Our Common Text 2004-2005

ROUGHLY EDITED COPY

ROCHESTER INSTITUTE OF TECHNOLOGY
OCTOBER 6, 2004.
COMMON TEXT SERIES.
PRESENTERS: BABAK ELAHI, ELENA SOMMERS, CHRISTINE KRAY

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This text is being provided in a rough draft format. Communication Access Realtime Translation (CART) is provided in order to facilitate communication accessibility and may not be a totally verbatim record of the proceedings.
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>> GOOD EVENING.

I'M LINDA REINFELD FROM THE

DEPARTMENT OF LANGUAGE AND

LITERATURE AND THIS YEAR CHAIR

OF THE COMMON TEXT COMMITTEE.

I'M HERE TO INTRODUCE THE

FIRST OF THREE EVENTS

ACCOMPANYING OUR READING OF

THIS YEAR'S COMMON NOVEL

REQUESTING HOUSE OF SAND AND

FOG" BY ANDRE DUBUS III.

TONIGHT WE'LL HEAR A PANEL ON

THE IMMIGRANT EXPERIENCE.

NEXT WEEK, AGAIN WEDNESDAY

NIGHT AT 7:30 BUT IN INGLE

AUDITORIUM, PROFESSOR MARK

PRICE WILL LECTURE ON

ADAPTATION AND TRANSLATION,

THE NOVEL AND FILM OF "HOUSE

OF SAND AND FOG."

ON WEDNESDAY NIGHT, OCTOBER

20th, AGAIN IN INGLE

AUDITORIUM, THE AUTHOR

HIMSELF, ANDRE DUBUS III WILL

BE HERE TO TALK TO US ABOUT

HIS WORK.

BEFORE HIS TALK, ABOUT 7:00 IN

THE LOBBY OF INGLE, HE WILL BE

AVAILABLE TO SIGN BOOKS, SO

DON'T MISS THAT HAPPY

OCCASION.

WITHOUT FURTHER ADO, LET ME

INTRODUCE TONIGHT'S PANEL.

BABAK ELAHI, WHO HOLDS A Ph.D.

FROM THE UNIVERSITY OF

ROCHESTER, IS ASSISTANT

PROFESSOR IN THE DEPARTMENT OF

LANGUAGE AND LITERATURE.

HE STUDIES CULTURAL AND

LITERARY REPRESENTATIONS AS

IMMIGRATION, ETHNICITY AND

RACE.

BORN IN IRAN, BABAK SPENT HIS

EARLY CHILDHOOD IN BRIGHTON,

ENGLAND, AND GREW UP DURING

HIS TEENS AND TWENTIES IN SAN

DIEGO, CALIFORNIA.

PROFESSOR ELAHI IS NOT ONLY A

RESPECTED SCHOLAR BUT A GOOD

TEACHER, AND THIS IS ONE WAY I

PERSONALLY KNOW.

WHEN I HAD TROUBLE LEARNING TO

PRONOUNCE HIS NAME, HE SAID I

DON'T KNOW IF THIS WILL HELP,

BUT HOW ABOUT YOU TRY SAYING

"BA-BACK-RAN."

SO WELCOME TO THE CHAIR OF

THIS PANEL, BABAK.

ELENA SOMMERS MOVED HERE FROM

RUSSIA 11 YEARS AGO.

IN ADDITION TO HER Ph.D. IN

COMPARATIVE LITERATURE FROM

UNIVERSITY OF ROCHESTER, SHE

HOLDS TWO MASTERS DEGREES, ONE

IN ENGLISH AND FRENCH FROM THE

MOSCOW STATE TEACHER TRAINING

UNIVERSITY AND ONE IN

INTERNATIONAL CONFLICT

RESOLUTION FROM THE UNIVERSITY

OF NOTRE DAME.

ELENA HAS BEEN TEACHING

WRITING AND LITERATURE, WOMEN

IN LITERATURE AND RUSSIAN

LITERATURE OF THE 20th

CENTURY.

SHE LOOKS HARMLESS ENOUGH, BUT

I'M NOT SURE.

SHE LISTS MERMAIDS AS ONE OF

HER AREAS OF RESEARCH, AND HER

FAVORITE COURSE TO TEACH IS

ENTITLED "DANGEROUS TEXT."

CHRISTINE KRAY HOLDS HER Ph.D.

IN ANTHROPOLOGY FROM THE

UNIVERSITY OF PENNSYLVANIA AND

IS CURRENTLY A MEMBER OF RIT'S

DEPARTMENT OF SOCIOLOGY AND

ANTHROPOLOGY.

HER FOCUS IS ON CULTURAL

CHANGE FROM THE CONTEXT OF

GLOBALIZATION, ESPECIALLY

OFFSHORE MANUFACTURING,

RELIGIOUS EVANGELIZATION AND

INTERNATIONAL TOURISM.

SHE CONDUCTED TWO YEARS OF

FIELDWORK IN THE MAYA REGION

OF SOUTHERN MEXICO, INCLUDING

RESEARCH IN THE NATIVE ONEIDA

LANGUAGE.

AT RIT SHE TEACHES COURSES ON

SOCIAL MOVEMENTS OF THE GLOBAL

ECONOMY, IMMIGRANTS OF THE

UNITED STATES, CULTURES OF

LATIN AMERICA, AND THE HONORS

CULTURAL ANTHROPOLOGY COURSE.

THANK YOU, CHRISTINE, FOR

AGREEING TO ADD YOUR

ANTHROPOLOGICAL INSIGHTS TO

THIS LITERARY PANEL.

PLEASE JOIN ME IN WELCOMING

THIS EVENING'S SPEAKERS.

(Applause)

>> GOOD EVENING.

I FOUND MYSELF WRITING VERY

PERSONALLY AS I STARTED

PUTTING MY THOUGHTS TOGETHER

FOR THIS PANEL, AND SCRIBBLING

OUT WHAT I HAD WRITTEN,

STARTING OVER.

YOU KNOW, WE TALK TO YOU GUYS

ABOUT PROCESS A LOT, AND I

CAME FACE TO FACE WITH HOW

DIFFICULT THAT PROCESS CAN

SOMETIMES BE.

BUT I FOUND THAT WHAT I CAME

UP WITH A COMBINATION OF

REFLECTING ON MY OWN PERSONAL

EXPERIENCE AS AN IRANIAN WHO

GREW UP IN THE UNITED STATES,

BECAME AN AMERICAN CITIZEN, AS

IS PRETTY MUCH ASSIMILATED

INTO AMERICAN SOCIETY, BUT

ALSO LOOKING AT BROADER

QUESTIONS OF WHAT IT MEANS TO

BE IRANIAN IN THE UNITED

STATES.

SO WHAT YOU'LL GET TONIGHT IS

A MIX OF SOME STATISTICS THAT

MIGHT HELP YOU, SOME

INFORMATION ABOUT, YOU KNOW,

WHAT-- HOW IRANIANS ARE

CATEGORIZED.

ARE THEY EXILED, ARE THEY

IMMIGRANTS?

BUT ALSO A GOOD DEAL OF

AUTOBIOGRAPHICAL DETAIL.

UNFORTUNATELY I SAY VERY

LITTLE ABOUT THE BOOK, SO YOU

MAY WANT TO THROW YOUR

QUESTIONS AT ME ABOUT THE BOOK

LATER.

THE TITLE OF MY TALK TODAY IS

"COMPLETING THE PICTURE,

IRANIANS IN AMERICA."

TRITA PARSI, AN IRANIAN

AMERICAN REVIEWER OF THE FILM

ADAPTATION OF ANDRE DUBUS

III's "HOUSE OF SAND AND FOG"

WRITES THE FILM IS A STEP IN

THE RIGHT DIRECTION IN TERMS

OF THE POPULAR MEDIA'S

PORTRAYAL OF IRANIAN

AMERICANS.

PORTRAYALS, SHE WRITES, ARE BY

NATURE SUBJECTIVE AND

INCOMPLETE, BUT AS

REPRESENTATIONS GO, THIS FILM

AND THE BOOK UPON WHICH IT IS

BASED MOVE AWAY FROM POPULAR

STEREOTYPES OF IRANIANS AS

TERRORISTS AND TOWARD THE

CREATION OF IRANIAN CHARACTERS

THAT ARE COMPLEX INDIVIDUALS,

DESPITE THE IMAGE'S SUBJECTIVE

AND INCOMPLETE NATURE.

I WHOLEHEARTEDLY AGREE.

THE BOOK AND THE FILM IMAGINE

IRANIANS WITH SENSITIVITY TO

CERTAIN POSITIVE CULTURAL

TRAITS, SUCH AS COHESIVE

FAMILY, AS WELL AS LOOK AT

SOME MORE NEGATIVE TRAITS THAT

CAN BE EITHER PERSONAL TO THE

CHARACTERS OR CAN BE CULTURAL,

SO FOR EXAMPLE EXCESSIVE

CONCERN FOR MATERIAL

APPEARANCES.

I CAN TELL YOU GROWING UP IN

SAN DIEGO THAT WAS PART OF THE

CULTURE I GREW UP IN.

THE COLONEL'S PRIDE.

I ALSO SAW THAT IN THE IRANIAN

COMMUNITY IN WHICH I GREW UP.

WHAT I WANT TO DO IN THE NEXT

SEVERAL MINUTES IS TO MAKE THE

PICTURE A BIT MORE COMPLETE.

SO THIS REVIEWER SAID THE

NOVEL IS GOOD, THE FILM IS

GOOD BUT IT'S NOT COMPLETE.

I'D LIKE TO ADD TO THAT, TO

COMPLETE THE PICTURE FOR YOU A

LITTLE BIT.

FOR WHAT IT'S WORTH, MY POINT

OF VIEW IS ALSO SUBJECTIVE AND

ALSO INCOMPLETE, BUT I THINK,

SUBJECTIVITY IS SOMETIMES

GOOD, TO ANNOUNCE THE POSITION

FROM WHICH YOU SPEAK, TO LET

PEOPLE KNOW THAT YOU YOURSELF

ARE INFLUENCED BY CERTAIN

EXPERIENCES, BY CERTAIN

INSTITUTIONS, BY CERTAIN

FAMILY STRUCTURE, BY CERTAIN

NATIONAL BACKGROUND AND SO

FORTH.

HOW DO WE COMPLETE THIS

PICTURE?

WELL, FIRST IMAGINE YOU HAVE A

SATELLITE'S EYE VIEW OF

IRANIANS IN THE U.S. AND

ACROSS THE WORLD.

WHAT DO WE SEE?

FROM OUR SATELLITE, WE-- WHERE

DO WE FIND IRANIANS?

HOW MANY OF THEM ARE

CONCENTRATED IN CALIFORNIA,

FOR EXAMPLE?

THE QUESTION OF IRANIAN

POPULATION IN THE U.S. HAS

BEEN A DIFFICULT ONE TO ANSWER

BECAUSE, AS ONE SOCIOLOGIST

HAS NOTED, IRANIANS IN AMERICA

DON'T LIKE TO PARTICIPATE IN

SURVEYS AND PUBLIC RESEARCH.

BUT THERE ARE SOME GUESSES.

ON THE LOW END, THE IRANIAN

STUDIES GROUP OF M.I.T.

ESTIMATES THAT THERE ARE

600,000 IRANIANS IN THE UNITED

STATES.

THAT'S ONE OF THE LOWEST

ESTIMATES I COULD FIND.

ON THE HIGHER END, THE IRANIAN

CHRISTIAN ASSOCIATION-- YOU

SHOULD CHECK OUT THEIR WEB

SITE.

IT'S INTERESTING.

(Chuckling)

PUTS THE NUMBER AT 1.5

MILLION, OUT OF THE TOTAL OF

4.1 MILLION OVERSEAS IRANIANS

WORLDWIDE.

OF THESE, IT IS ESTIMATED THAT

PERHAPS 500,000 OR 600,000

LIVE IN SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA;

BUT EVEN HERE THE NUMBERS

RANGE AS LOW AS 100,000.

ARE THESE IRANIANS IMMIGRANTS

OR EXILES?

THAT MIGHT BE THE NEXT

QUESTION THAT COMES TO MIND,

AND WHAT'S THE DIFFERENCE?

MOST SOCIOLOGISTS WHO STUDY

IRANIAN AMERICAN CULTURE REFER

TO IT AS A DIASPORA.

WE CAN DEFINE DIASPORA AS MASS

MIGRATION OF A PEOPLE FROM A

NATIONAL OR EVEN REGIONAL

CENTER TO FOREIGN PERIPHERIES.

THIS DISPLACED GROUP HOLDS

ONTO MEMORIES AND CREATES

MYTHS, OFTEN UNREALISTIC ONES,

OF THE OLD COUNTRY.

THEY SOMETIMES FEEL UNACCEPTED

IN A HOST COUNTRY AND ARE

USUALLY COMMITTED TO RETURNING

HOME AND REESTABLISHING AN

OLDER POLITICAL AND SOCIAL

ORDER.

THEIR EXPERIENCE IS MARKED BY

NOSTALGIA, LONGING AND OFTEN

UNFULFILLED DESIRE.

MY OWN EXPERIENCE IS THAT I

HAVE BECOME AN IMMIGRANT, AND

THE IMMIGRANT AS OPPOSED TO A

MEMBER OF THE DIASPORA IS

SOMEONE WHO, TO BE BRIEF,

ASSIMILATES INTO THE HOST

SOCIETY, COMMITS TO THE CIVIC

AND CULTURAL EXPECTATIONS OF

THE HOST CULTURE, AND SEVERS

ANY SUBSTANTIVE TIES TO THE

HOMELAND.

WHILE IMMIGRANTS MAY

TRANSPLANT AND TRANSFORM

CULTURAL ASPECTS OF THE OLD

COUNTRY, THEY DO SO IN A WAY

THAT FITS INTO THE DOMINANT

CULTURE OF THE HOST COUNTRY.

HOWEVER, AS ONE SOCIOLOGIST

HAS PUT IT, NILOU MOSTOFI AND

I HAVE A WORK SITE AVAILABLE

AFTER THE TALK.

THIS SOCIOLOGIST HAS SUGGESTED

IRANIANS ARE DIVIDED BETWEEN A

PRIVATE SENSE OF NOSTALGIA FOR

IRAN AS IT EXISTED BEFORE THE

1979 REVOLUTION OR EVEN AFTER,

AND ON THE OTHER HAND PUBLIC

INTEGRATION INTO AMERICAN

SOCIETY.

SO OFTEN THIS SENSE OF THE

DIVIDED SELF.

I ACT ONE WAY AT HOME.

I ACT A DIFFERENT WAY IN

PUBLIC.

AGAIN LOOKING AT THE BROAD

DEMOGRAPHIC VIEW, WHAT DO WE

SEE AMONG IRANIANS?

I WOULD SUGGEST THAT IRANIANS

ARE MOVING AWAY FROM BEING

EXILED TOWARDS BEING

IMMIGRANTS.

MANY OF US CAME HERE FEELING

EXCLUDED FROM OUR HOME COUNTRY

AND UNACCEPTED IN AMERICA, BUT

OVER THE PAST 20, 25 YEARS,

THAT HAS CHANGED QUITE A BIT.

AGAIN LOOKING AT THE BROAD

DEMOGRAPHIC VIEW, WHAT DO WE

SEE?

ACCORDING TO ONE JOURNALIST

WRITING FOR A POPULAR

AUDIENCE, AND A SOCIOLOGIST

WRITING FOR AN ACADEMIC

AUDIENCE, THE DEMOGRAPHICS OF

THE IRANIAN AMERICAN COMMUNITY

ARE CLEAR.

IRANIANS IN LOS ANGELES BY AND

LARGE ARE WEALTHY ELITES WHO

TEND, ESPECIALLY IN THE SECOND

GENERATION, TO SLIDE EASILY

INTO HIGH-PAYING JOBS,

ENTREPRENEURIAL ENTERPRISES OR

PRIVILEGED POSITIONS IN

ACADEME, GOVERNMENT OR

BUSINESS.

I'M STILL WAITING FOR THE

HIGH-PAYING JOB BUT I'LL LET

THAT SLIDE FOR NOW.

SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA IRANIANS

ARE OFTEN COMPARED TO MIAMI

CUBANS, WHOSE SYMPATHIES LIE

WITH A DEPOSED U.S.-BACKED

REGIME, BATISTA IN THE CASE OF

THE CUBANS AND REZA SHAH

PAHLAVI IN THE CASE OF THE

IRANIANS.

ETHICALLY AND LINGUISTICALLY

IRANIANS IN L.A. ARE DIVERSE

INCLUDING ETHNIC TURKS, CURDS

AND ARMENIANS, CHRISTIANS,

JEW, Bah '¡s AND ZOROASTRIANS

AND MUSLIMS AND SPEAKERS OF

TURKISH AND GILAKI, WHICH IS A

NORTHEASTERN DIALECT WITHIN

IRAN.

SO TO GO BACK TO OUR SORT OF

SATELLITE VIEW, THERE'S QUITE

A DIVERSE GROUP OF IRANIANS IN

THE U.S.

MANY OF THEM ARE STILL

CONSIDER THEMSELVES EXILES AND

FEEL OPPOSED TO THE REGIME IN

POWER IN IRAN NOW AND FIND IT

DIFFICULT TO BECOME

FULL-FLEDGED AMERICAN.

WHILE OTHERS, ESPECIALLY IN

THE SECOND GENERATION-- I'M

THINKING HERE OF ESMAIL IN

"HOUSE OF SAND AND FOG"-- CAN

BECOME FULL-FLEDGED CITIZENS

AND ARE MOVING MORE TOWARDS

BECOMING IMMIGRANTS AS OPPOSED

TO BEING EXILES OR PART OF A

DIASPORA.

OKAY.

BUT THERE'S ONLY SO MUCH WE

CAN LEARN FROM THIS SATELLITE

VIEW OF IRANIAN EXILE AND

IMMIGRANT SOCIETY.

FROM THE VIEWPOINT OF A

PASSENGER JET WINDOW, WE CAN

SEE HOW PEOPLE LIKE ME GOT

HERE AND HOW ATTACHED OR

UNATTACHED WE ARE TO THE

AMERICAN SOIL OR THE IRANIAN

SOIL.

SEVERAL RECENTLY PUBLISHED

MEMOIRS BY IRANIAN AMERICANS

BEGIN BY EITHER DESCRIBING A

FLIGHT FROM IRAN TO AMERICA OR

FROM AMERICA TO IRAN.

AIRPLANES AND AIRLINES ARE

HIGHLY CHARGED CULTURAL SPACES

FOR IRANIANS AND CAN BECOME

HIGHLY SYMBOLIC IN LITERARY

REPRESENTATIONS.

THE FACT THAT COLONEL BEHRANI

FOR EXAMPLE FLED IRAN IN A

MILITARY PLANE AND THAT HE

DEALS IN THE EXCHANGE OF

FIGHTER JETS BETWEEN ISRAEL,

IRAN AND THE UNITED STATES IS

SIGNIFICANT.

I WON'T GO INTO IT HERE.

IF YOU WANT TO TALK ABOUT THAT

ISSUE LATER, WE CAN DISCUSS

IT.

HOWEVER, IN MANY OTHER IMAGES

OF PASSENGER AIRLINES, AND

THEIR CIVILIAN PASSENGERS,

WHAT AT FIRST SEEMS FAIRLY

MUNDANE CAN BE HIGHLY CHARGED

AND SIGNIFICANT.

FOR EXAMPLE STEVEN SPIELBERG'S

FILM "THE TERMINAL" STARRING

TOM HANKS IS BASED ON THE REAL

LIFE EXPERIENCE OF AN IRANIAN

REFUGEE, MEHRAN KARIMI

NASSERIA, WHO HAS BEEN LIVING

IN THE CHARLES de GAULLE

AIRPORT FOR THE PAST 16 YEARS.

INITIALLY BECAUSE OF A

BUREAUCRATIC MISUNDERSTANDING,

BUT LATER BECAUSE OF HIS OWN

DETERIORATING MENTAL STATE.

IN ANOTHER STORY INVOLVING AN

AIRPLANE'S EYE VIEW OF IRANIAN

MIGRATION, AN IRANIAN MAN

HIJACKED A PLANE.

HIS FAMILY'S ON BOARD, AND THE

HIJACKING IS HIS DESPERATE

ATTEMPT AT GETTING THEM ALL TO

AMERICA WHERE THEY HOPE TO

JOIN OTHER RELATIVES.

THE HIJACKER'S WIFE AND KIDS

BEGIN TO ARGUE ABOUT WHERE

EXACTLY TO FLY THE PLANE.

ANOTHER YOUNG IRANIAN BEGINS

TO BECOME CONCERNED.

HE HAS NEVER LEFT IRAN AND

COMES FROM A HUMBLE

TRADITIONAL FAMILY.

HE SAYS "IF ANYTHING HAPPENS

TO ME, MY LAST WISH IS THAT MY

BODY BE BURIED IN LOS

ANGELES."

THERE WAS SUPPOSED TO BE A

LAUGH THERE.

THANKS, DAVE.

YOU GOT IT, RIGHT.

THIS IS NOT A JOKE.

OBVIOUSLY BECAUSE YOU DIDN'T

LAUGH.

BUT THE SCENARIO IS A FILM

TITLED "LOW HEIGHTS" OR "LOW

ALTITUDE" BY IRANIAN DIRECTOR

EBRAHIM HATAMIKIA.

AT THIS POINT, I WANT TO SHIFT

INTO MORE SORT OF PERSONAL

DETAIL.

ONE WAY TO NARRATE ONE'S LIFE

IS TO THINK ABOUT THE PLANE

TRIPS YOU'VE TAKEN.

I TRIED OVER AND OVER AGAIN TO

SORT OF GIVE YOU MY BIO IN

THIS, AND THIS SEEMED THE BEST

WAY TO DO IT.

AGAIN, A PASSENGER PLANE'S

VIEW OF WHAT IT MEANS TO BE AN

IRANIAN MIGRANT.

MY OWN FAMILY'S HISTORY CAN BE

NARRATED THROUGH THE VEHICLE

OF OUR FLIGHTS ON PASSENGER

JETS.

THE FIRST TIME I RODE IN A

PASSENGER JET, I WAS FOUR,

1969.

MY MOTHER, AT THE REQUEST OF

HER TWO OLDEST SONS, THEN 15

AND 16 YEARS OLD, PUT HERSELF

AND HER CHILDREN ON AN IRAN

AIR FLIGHT TO ENGLAND, WHERE

MY OLDER BROTHERS WOULD

EVENTUALLY ATTEND COLLEGE.

MY FATHER STAYED IN IRAN TO

WORK.

WE LIVED IN ENGLAND FOR A

LITTLE LESS THAN SEVEN YEARS,

AND DURING THIS TIME I WENT ON

ONE ROUND-TRIP FLIGHT WITH MY

MOTHER TO IRAN AND BACK TO

ENGLAND IN 1974.

THAT WAS WHEN I WAS NINE.

ON A SIDE NOTE, AT AGE NINE, I

ALREADY FELT MORE WESTERN THAN

IRANIAN.

WHEN VISITING THE GOLDEN DOMED

SHRINE OF IMAM REZA-- THIS IS

IN A TOWN CALLED MASHAD IN

IRAN-- VISITING THE SHRINE, MY

MOTHER AND I WERE STOPPED BY A

GUARD WHO TOLD MY MOTHER SHE

SHOULD MAKE SURE HER DAUGHTER

IS WEARING A VEIL.

AFTER MY MOTHER CORRECTED THIS

ERROR, HE TOLD HER TO GIVE ME

A HAIRCUT.

TWO YEARS LATER, I WENT ON MY

NEXT FLIGHT WITH MY MOTHER AND

ONE OF MY THREE BROTHERS, THIS

TIME TO THE UNITED STATES IN

1976.

WE FLEW INTO WASHINGTON D.C.

BUT FLEW AGAIN WITHIN A WEEK

TO SETTLE IN SAN DIEGO.

MY PARENTS DIVORCED DURING THE

IRANIAN REVOLUTION.

YOU CAN IMAGINE IT WAS KIND OF

A TRAUMATIC TIME FOR ME,

RIGHT?

(Chuckling)

BEFORE THE DUST HAD SETTLED.

FOR PERSONAL REASONS THAT I

NEED NOT OUTLINE BUT ALSO FOR

AN INABILITY TO ASSIMILATE

INTO AMERICAN CULTURE IN HIS

LATE 50s, MY FATHER RETURNED

TO A COUNTRY WHOSE SOCIETY WAS

BEGINNING TO REBUILD ITSELF.

HE WENT BACK IN PART TO SAVE

SOME LAND WE OWNED ON THE

SHORES OF THE CASPIAN SEA.

WE WERE BEHRANI'S NEIGHBORS,

RIGHT?

BUT HE ENDED UP LOSING IT TO

THE ISLAMIC REGIME.

MY MOTHER TOOK FEWER PLANE

RIDES, BUT SHE, TOO, HAS

RETURNED TO IRAN TO CARE FOR

AN ELDERLY SISTER.

SHE HAD PLANNED ON MOVING BACK

AND FORTH FROM HERE TO IRAN IN

ORDER TO BE ABLE TO WATCH HER

GRANDCHILDREN GROW UP, BUT SHE

NOW FINDS HERSELF STUCK IN

IRAN, NOT BECAUSE OF POLITICAL

REASONS BUT BECAUSE OF HER

SISTER'S AND HER OWN HEALTH.

HOPING TO SEE HER SOON.

(Chuckling)

MY PARENTS' FLIGHT TO THE

UNITED STATES WAS ALSO A

DESCENT.

THEY ENDED UP LOSING A LOT OF

MONEY.

THEY ENDED UP NOT MANAGING

THEIR FINANCES AS WELL AS THEY

COULD HAVE, AND BY THE TIME

THAT MY MOM LEFT THE UNITED

STATES TO GO BACK TO IRAN, SHE

HAD GONE FROM BEING THE

HOUSEWIFE OF A FAIRLY

PRIVILEGED ARCHITECT-- MY

FATHER-- TO WORKING JOBS LIKE

MANAGING A BAGEL STORE OR

WORKING AT A MOVIE THEATER.

AND SO, YOU KNOW, THESE KINDS

OF STORIES DO HAPPEN.

YOU KNOW, I'VE LIVED THROUGH

THIS.

AND A LOT OF IT HAS TO DID--

AND I'M GOING TO GET TO THIS

TOWARDS THE END OF MY TALK--

HAS TO DO WITH FAMILY

DYNAMICS, AND I WANT TO GET

BACK TO THAT LATER.

MY TWO OLDEST BROTHERS HAVE

PERHAPS LOGGED THE MOST

FREQUENT FLYER MILES.

MY OLDEST BROTHER, HUMAYUN

MOVED TO SAN FRANCISCO FOR

AWHILE WHERE IRONICALLY HE

REDISCOVERED HIS HOMELAND AND

HIS RELIGION.

WE ARE GENERALLY AN AGNOSTIC

AND SECULAR HOUSE HOW WOULD

BUT HE FOUND THAT BELIEF IN

ALLAH ANSWERED A CERTAIN

LONGING AND FILLED A CERTAIN

EMPTINESS HE HAD BEEN FEELING

SINCE HIS CHILDHOOD.

IN THE EARLY 1990s HE FLEW

BACK TO IRAN TO STAY FOR A

PERIOD OF THREE OR FOUR YEARS,

WHERE HE WORKED AS A BANKER,

MARRIED AND FATHERED TWO

CHILDREN.

BUT HE AGAIN RETURNED TO THE

UNITED STATES.

HE HAD GONE TO IRAN WITH THE

HOPE OF FITTING IN SOMEWHERE.

HE IS A DEVOUT MUSLIM AND WAS

SUPPORTIVE OF THE IDEA OF AN

ISLAMIC REPUBLIC.

HOWEVER, HE SOON CONFRONTED

THE BUREAUCRATIC NIGHTMARE

THAT IRAN IS AND BEGAN TO FEAR

FOR HIS WIFE'S SAFETY IN A

COUNTRY WHERE RELIGIOUS LAW

OFTEN ARBITRARILY UNDERMINES

SECULAR RULE OF LAW.

HE RETURNED TO THE U.S. IN THE

MID 1990s AND HE NOW LIVES IN

SAN DIEGO WHERE HE TEACHES

ECONOMICS AT NIGHT AND DRIVES

A CAB BY DAY.

MY SECOND-OLDEST BROTHER,

FARHAD, FOUND A DIFFERENT KIND

OF RELIGION, ART.

AESTHETIC EXPERIENCE AND

ARTISTIC CREATION HAVE GUIDED

HIM ALL HIS LIFE, AND IN EARLY

1980s HE LEFT THE U.S. NOT TO

GO HOME, BUT TO MOVE TO

FLORENCE, ITALY, WHERE HE

LIVED FOR NINE YEARS.

AFTER FAILING TO EARN A LIVING

AS A PAINTER, JEWELRY MAKER

AND FASHION DESIGNER, MY

BROTHER RETURNED TO THE UNITED

STATES.

FARHAD NOW TELLS ME THAT HE IS

THINKING OF MOVING BACK TO

IRAN, BOTH TO WORK AND TO LEND

HIS VOICE TO THE GROWING

REFORM MOVEMENT IN THAT

COUNTRY.

THESE FLIGHTS WITHIN MY FAMILY

DEMONSTRATE THE WAVES IN WHICH

IRANIAN IMMIGRANT COMMUNITIES

ARE LINKED BACK TO IRAN.

EVEN FOR PEOPLE WHO ASSIMILATE

INTO AMERICAN SOCIETY.

A PAIR OF SOCIOLOGISTS, FISHER

AND ABETTI, DESCRIBE THE

IRANIAN DIASPORA IN

MATERIALS-- TERMS OF A WEAVING

PROCESS.

LIKE THE PROCESS OF WEAVING A

PERSIAN CARPET, IRANIAN

CULTURE IS CREATED BY THE

MOVEMENT OF A SHUTTLE BACK AND

FORTH ACROSS A LOOM.

ONE END OF THE LOOM IS

SITUATED IN IRAN, THE OTHER IN

AMERICA OR IN OTHER CASES IN

EUROPE.

FIRST PHYSICALLY, ON PASSENGER

JETS; NOW VIRTUALLY ON THE

INTERNET AND CERTAINLY

CULTURALLY AND EMOTIONALLY IN

LESS TANGIBLE WAYS, IRANIAN

CULTURE IS WOVEN INTO ITS

UNIQUE GLOBAL DESIGN, LIKE A

PERSIAN CARPET.

MY OWN EXPERIENCE CONFIRMS

THIS MODEL.

MY MOTHER IS NOW IN IRAN, AS I

SAID, AND WE ADD OUR OWN

THREAD TO THIS LOOM THROUGH

INTANGIBLE AS WELL AS TANGIBLE

WAYS; FROM PHONE CONVERSATIONS

TO THE PACKAGES OF DRY GOODS I

OFTEN RECEIVE.

MY CHILDREN HAVE ACQUIRED A

TASTE FOR THINGS THAT THEIR

FRIENDS FIND UNUSUAL,

INTERESTING AND OCCASIONALLY

VERY DESIRABLE.

ONE OF THEIR FAVORITE FOODS,

FOR EXAMPLE, IS THIS THING

CALLED LAVASHAK AND IT'S THIS

DRIED FRUIT SPREAD THAT'S

REALLY VERY TART.

IT'S GREAT STUFF.

ANYWAY, MADE WITH POMEGRANATES

AND PLUMS.

IT IS ONLY THE BROTHER CLOSEST

IN AGE TO ME, SIX AS OWE POSED

TO TEN OR TWELVE YEARS MY

SENIOR, WHO SETTLED DOWN IN

SAN DIEGO AND LIVES THERE

STILL, EXCEPT FOR A ONE-YEAR

HIATUS IN BOISE, IDAHO.

FARSHID AND I BOTH MARRIED

AMERICAN WOMEN AND TOOK FEWER

JOURNEYS BY PLANE THAN OUR

OLDER BROTHERS.

PERHAPS ONE REASON I FEEL LIKE

AN IMMIGRANT AS OPPOSED TO AN

EXILE, AN IRANIAN AMERICAN

RATHER THAN AN IRANIAN EXILE

IN AMERICA, IS THAT I'VE TAKEN

MANY MORE ROAD TRIPS AND FEWER

FLIGHTS THAN THE REST OF MY

FAMILY.

IN 1992, MY WIFE AND I LOADED

UP OUR HONDA WITH MOST OF OUR

STUFF, SENT THE REST OF IT

U.P.S. TO HER PARENTS AND

DROVE FROM SAN DIEGO TO

ROCHESTER.

BEING ON THE ROAD, TRAVELLING

BY CAR RATHER THAN PLANE.

PERHAPS THIS WAS BOTH

MATERIALLY AND SYMBOLICALLY

THE LAST STEP IN THE LONG

PROCESS OF MY ASSIMILATION

INTO AMERICAN SOCIETY.

IT'S IRONIC, THEN, THAT

AMERICA'S CONTROL OF IRANIAN

POLITICAL AND ECONOMIC

SELF-DETERMINATION IN THE MID

20th CENTURY IS IN PART WHAT

ALLOWED ME TO DRIVE ACROSS

COUNTRY AFFORDABLY.

OKAY.

WE'VE GONE FROM A SATELLITE

VIEW OF IRAN AND SOME

STATISTICS TO JETLINER WINDOW

VIEW, BUT PERHAPS THE MOST

TELLING WAY TO UNDERSTAND

IRANIAN CULTURE IS TO BE THE

FLY ON THE WALL IN AN IRANIAN

FAMILY, AND I JUST WANT TO

CLOSE BY FOCUSING ON THAT

ASPECT AND GOING BACK TO THE

NOVEL, I SHOULD SAY SOMETHING

ABOUT THE NOVEL.

ONE OF THE THINGS I FIND

FASCINATING ABOUT THIS NOVEL

IS THE WAY IT PLAYS AROUND

WITH AGE, WITH GENERATIONS.

ONE ALTERNATE TITLE FOR MY

TALK TONIGHT WAS "TALKING

ABOUT MY GENERATION," AND IT

IS PRECISELY PEOPLE MY AGE WHO

ARE LESS REPRESENTED IN THIS

BOOK.

WE HAVE BEHRANI'S POINT OF

VIEW, OF COURSE.

HE LEAVES IRAN IN HIS LATE

50s, MAYBE IN HIS 60s.

HE LEAVES BEHIND PRIVILEGE.

HE LEAVES BEHIND WEALTH, AND

AS HE SAYS, HE LOOKS BACK AT A

SOCIETY THAT'S BEEN TOTALLY

DESTROYED.

FOR IRANIANS IN EXILE, THE

IRAN THAT THEY LEFT NO LONGER

REALLY EXISTS.

IT ONLY EXISTS IN SOME

IMAGINARY PLACE.

AND THAT WAS TRUE FOR HIM.

AT THE OTHER END, YOU HAVE

ESMAIL, HIS SON, WHO WAS AN

INFANT WHEN HE LEFT IRAN.

NOW CLEARLY, IN THE NOVEL WE

SEE HIM HAVING SOME

DIFFICULTIES WITH HIS FATHER.

HE WANTS HIS FATHER TO SELL

THE HOUSE BACK.

HE HAS CERTAIN SYMPATHIES WITH

THIS WOMAN, KATHY NICOLO AND,

YOU KNOW, SOME OF THAT IS

PERSONAL.

SOME OF IT IS PERHAPS

CULTURAL, THAT BEHRANI,

BECAUSE OF HIS UPBRINGING,

COULD NOT ALLOW HIMSELF TO

HAVE THIS HAPPEN.

A LOT OF IT I GUESS HAS TO DO

WITH THE FACT THAT HE'S THE

HEAD OF THE HOUSEHOLD OF

COURSE AND HE KNOWS THEIR

FINANCES BETTER THAN HIS SON.

AT ANY RATE WHAT YOU DON'T GET

IS A MORE COMPLETE PICTURE OF

THE DAUGHTER, SORAYA, AND OF

HER HUSBAND.

HER HUSBAND IN PARTICULAR IS A

CARICATURE.

HE'S VERY MATERIALISTIC.

HE'S INTERESTED IN VIDEO GAMES

AND THAT'S ABOUT ALL WE KNOW

ABOUT HIM.

AS SOMEONE WHO'S ALMOST 40

READING THIS BOOK, I THOUGHT,

WELL, WHERE AM I?

WHY AM I NOT HERE?

THE REASON I'M NOT THERE, I

THINK, OR THE REASON PEOPLE MY

AGE AREN'T THERE MORE

SIGNIFICANTLY IS THAT I DON'T

THINK DUBUS COULD HAVE PULLED

THAT OFF AS EASILY.

OR HE COULDN'T HAVE PULLED

THAT OFF IN THE WAY HE DID THE

GENERATION OF BEHRANI.

AN IRANIAN MY AGE MIGHT HAVE

BEEN ABLE TO SEE KATHY NICOLO

IN A DIFFERENT LIGHT, MIGHT

HAVE BEEN ABLE TO DO THINGS

DIFFERENTLY IN THAT SITUATION

THAT BEHRANI COULD NOT.

NOW TO SHIFT AGAIN TO MY OWN

PERSONAL EXPERIENCE, PEOPLE OF

MY GENERATION ARE OFTEN

REFERRED TO AS "1.5 GENERATION

IMMIGRANTS."

WE'RE SORT OF IN BETWEEN.

IN MY BROTHER'S CASE, MY

OLDEST BROTHER'S CASE, THAT'S

ESPECIALLY TRUE.

THEY WERE 15 WHEN THEY MOVED.

THEY HAD ALREADY BEGUN TO

ESTABLISH THEMSELVES SOCIALLY

AND EMOTIONALLY IN IRAN AND

ARE PLOPPED INTO ANOTHER

CULTURE.

FOR BOTH OF THEM WHAT I SAW

WAS MEN, YOUNG MEN WHO FELT

ABANDONED BY BOTH SIDES OF THE

EQUATION.

ONE IRANIAN SAYING THAT BOTH

SIDES OF THE STICK WERE DIRTY.

ONE END WAS ROTTEN; THE OTHER

ONE WAS FORGOTTEN.

AND I SAW THAT.

I SAW THAT ON A VERY PERSONAL

LEVEL.

ONE CLOSING ANECDOTE THAT KIND

OF DEMONSTRATES THE

DIFFICULTIES AND MAYBE BRINGS

BACK THE FAMILY DYNAMICS TO

POLITICS IS AN EXCHANGE I HAD

WITH MY OLDEST BROTHER WHEN HE

FIRST BECAME VERY DEVOUT

MUSLIM.

AT THE TIME I HAD STARTED

DOING THINGS LIKE READING KURT

VONNEGUT.

I READ "CAT'S CRADLE" AT THE

TIME AND IT KIND OF BLEW MY

MIND.

I THOUGHT, OKAY, HERE'S A

CRITIQUE IN PART.

I HAVEN'T REREAD IT RECENTLY

SO CORRECT ME IF I'M WRONG,

BUT HERE'S A CRITIQUE OF

ORGANIZED RELIGION, EQUATING

IT IN MANY WAYS TO CULTS.

AND MY BROTHER CAME BACK FROM

SAN FRANCISCO AND I WENT UP TO

HIM AND I SAID, "I READ THIS

BOOK.

THIS IS AMAZING.

THIS IS A GREAT PHILOSOPHY.

WHAT DO YOU THINK?"

HE HAD BECOME A DEVOUT MUSLIM.

I WASN'T COMPLETELY AWARE OF

WHAT THAT WAS ALL ABOUT.

AND AT THAT POINT THERE WAS A

SORT OF-- I FELT THIS LULL,

THAT HERE WAS A MAN WHO I

LOOKED UP TO.

HERE WAS SOMEONE WHO HAD

GUIDED ME, VERY MUCH IN A

SECULAR WAY UP UNTIL THAT

POINT, AND SUDDENLY THERE WAS

THIS SPLIT.

I THINK IT'S COMPLEXITIES LIKE

THAT THAT ARE DIFFICULT TO

REPRESENT IN A NOVEL LIKE

THIS.

AGAIN I GO BACK TO THE

BEGINNING OF MY TALK.

CLEARLY IT IS A STEP IN THE

RIGHT DIRECTION IN TERMS OF

PORTRAYALS OF IRANIANS.

IT'S COMPLEX AND IT'S

INTERESTING.

BUT AGAIN IT'S NOT COMPLETE,

AND IN TERMS OF FAMILY

DYNAMICS, I DON'T THINK IT

DEMONSTRATES THE KINDS OF

COMPLEXITIES AND ISSUES THAT

WE FIND IN IRANIAN FAMILIES IN

UNITED STATES.

THANK YOU.

AND I WILL TURN IT OVER TO...

(Applause)

...CHRISTINE KRAY.

>> Christine: HELLO, EVERYONE.

I'M REALLY PLEASED TO BE HERE

AS AN ANTHROPOLOGIST.

THE ONLY SOCIAL SCIENTIST ON

THE PANEL, AND BABAK KIND OF

STOLE THE THUNDER.

NO, NO, NO.

I'M JUST KIDDING.

I WAS GOING TO POINT OUT-- HAD

BEEN PLANNING ON POINTING OUT

THE DIFFERENCES AND SOCIAL

SCIENTIFIC AND LITERARY

PERSPECTIVES, BUT SO MUCH FOR

THAT.

BUT I GUESS IT'S APPROPRIATE

BECAUSE, WHEN I BEGAN COLLEGE

I BEGAN AS A LITERATURE MAJOR.

LITERATURE WAS MY FIRST LOVE,

AND THE REASON I LOVED IT SO

MUCH WAS BECAUSE I THOUGHT IT

GAVE ME AN ENTREES, A KIND OF

WINDOW IN OTHER CULTURES.

AND OF COURSE I DISCOVERED

ANTHROPOLOGY WHERE I COULD DO

THE FIELDWORK ON MY OWN BUT

STILL I HAVE THIS GREAT LOVE

FOR LITERATURE.

SO TODAY, I WANT TO TALK ABOUT

THREE MAIN THINGS.

I WANT TO TALK-- THE FIRST TWO

THINGS I WANT TO TALK ABOUT

ARE COMMON EXPERIENCES AMONG

IMMIGRANTS THAT ARE REFLECTED

AS WELL IN THE NOVEL.

DOWNWARD MOBILITY AND BUSINESS

ENTREPRENEURSHIP.

AND THEN I WANT TO TALK ABOUT

CULTURE AS A WEB OF MEANINGS,

AS A SYSTEM OF MEANINGS AND

VALUES.

AND THEN TAKING THAT

PERSPECTIVE ON CULTURE, SEE IF

WE CAN ANALYZE THE NOVEL FROM

THAT PERSPECTIVE.

SO FIRST ABOUT DOWNWARD

MOBILITY.

THE STEREOTYPICAL IMMIGRANT IN

THE UNITED STATES,

STEREOTYPES, RIGHT, IS THE

MEXICAN WETBACK AS A PERSON

WHO WORKS IN MEXICO WITH

FARMERS.

I HAVE A GREAT DEAL OF

AFFECTION FOR MEXICAN FARMERS,

BUT THEY ARE NOT IN FACT THE

TYPICAL IMMIGRANT IN THE

UNITED STATES.

IN FACT BEHRANI IS MORE

TYPICAL.

AND THAT IS BECAUSE THE FIRST

GROUP FROM ANY NATION THAT

IMMIGRATES INTO THE UNITED

STATES TENDS TO COME FROM AN

UPPER-MIDDLE-CLASS BACKGROUND

OR ABOVE, HAS A VERY HIGH

DEGREE OF EDUCATION AND

USUALLY WORKS IN PROFESSIONAL

JOBS.

IN FACT ACCORDING TO THE NEW

IMMIGRANT SURVEY, QUOTE, "THE

MEDIAN YEARS OF SCHOOLING FOR

LEGAL IMMIGRANTS IS 13 YEARS,"

WHICH IS ONE YEAR HIGHER THAN

THAT OF THE U.S. NATIVE BORN.

THAT INCLUDES ALL IMMIGRANT

GROUPS, INCLUDING IMMIGRANT

GROUPS THAT HAVE BEEN COMING

TO THE UNITED STATES FOR A

MUCH LONGER PERIOD OF TIME.

IRANIANS ARE PART OF ANOTHER

GROUP OF IMMIGRANTS THAT ARE

OFTEN CALLED "THE NEW

IMMIGRANTS."

THERE WAS A MAJOR IMMIGRATION

ACT ENACTED IN 1965 CALLED THE

HART-CELLAR ACT, WHICH OPENED

UP THE UNITED STATES FOR

IMMIGRATION TO MANY COUNTRIES

WHICH HAD BEEN VIRTUALLY

EXCLUDED UP TO THAT TIME,

INCLUDING MOST ASIAN NATIONS.

SO BEHRANI AND HIS FAMILY

COMING IN THE 1980s, I GUESS

WE'RE LED TO BELIEVE,

REPRESENTS THAT FIRST WAVE OF

IMMIGRANTS FROM THAT COUNTRY.

BUT WHY IS THAT THE CASE?

WHY IS IT THAT THE FIRST GROUP

TO COME FROM ANY NATION HAD

THIS UPPER-CLASS HIGHLY

EDUCATED PROFESSIONAL

BACKGROUND?

PARTS OF THE REASON HAS TO DO

WITH VISA REQUIREMENTS.

MOST OF THE VISA CATEGORIES

AVAILABLE GIVE PRIVILEGE TO

PEOPLE FROM THOSE BACKGROUNDS.

IN ADDITION, IN ORDER TO

FINANCE THE TRIP ITSELF, TO

HAVE THE ENGLISH SKILLS,

LITERACY SKILLS, THE SKILLS OF

WORKING THROUGH INTERNATIONAL

BUREAUCRACIES, AGAIN PEOPLE

FROM THOSE KINDS OF

BACKGROUNDS ARE PRIVILEGED.

HOWEVER, ONCE THEY ARE HERE,

MOST OF THE PEOPLE EXPERIENCE

A DOWNWARD MOBILITY RATHER

THAN UPWARD MOBILITY.

THEY MOVE DOWN IN SOCIAL

CLASS, DOWN IN THEIR ECONOMIC

WEALTH, INCLUDING MANY WOMEN

WHO HAD MAIDS AND NANNIES AND

COOKS IN THEIR HOUSEHOLDS,

IN THE HOME COUNTRY BEGAN TO

WORK AS MAIDS AND NANNIES AND

COOKS IN AMERICAN HOMES.

THAT'S JUST ONE EXAMPLE.

AND WE CAN BEGIN TO UNDERSTAND

THAT THROUGH A COUPLE OF

ANALYTICAL CATEGORIES CALLED

SOCIAL AND CULTURAL CAPITAL;

CAPITAL OF COURSE REFERS TO

SOMETHING THAT IS INVESTED IN

ORDER TO REAP PROFIT.

WE TEND TO THINK OF ECONOMIC

CAPITAL: MONEY, TOOLS,

MACHINERY THAT ARE INVESTED IN

A BUSINESS VENTURE.

BUT THERE'S ALSO SOCIAL

CAPITAL AND CULTURAL CAPITAL,

AND FOR IMMIGRANTS, THEIR

SOCIAL AND THEIR CULTURAL

CAPITAL ARE GENERALLY

MEANINGLESS WHEN THEY COME TO

A NEW COUNTRY.

THEIR SOCIAL-- CULTURAL

CAPITAL ARE ROOTED IN THE HOME

COUNTRY.

SOCIAL CAPITAL INCLUDES ONE'S

SOCIAL CONNECTIONS, WHO YOU

KNOW THAT CAN WRITE YOU A

LETTER OF RECOMMENDATION; A

BUSINESS CONTACT THAT YOU MEET

AT THE COUNTRY CLUB OR GOLF

COURSE; SOMEONE WHO CAN GIVE

YOU AN INTRODUCTION TO A

POTENTIAL EMPLOYER.

ALL OF THESE SOCIAL CONTACTS

THAT YOU MIGHT HAVE SPENT A

LIFETIME DEVELOPING IN IRAN

ARE MEANINGLESS WHEN COMING TO

THE NEW COUNTRY.

CULTURAL CAPITAL INCLUDES

ONE'S EDUCATION, SOCIAL SKILLS

AND MANNERS AND LANGUAGE

SKILLS.

AGAIN, VERY OFTEN IMMIGRANTS,

CULTURAL CAPITAL IS

MEANINGLESS IN THEIR NEW

ADOPTIVE COUNTRY.

THEIR EDUCATION MAY NOT BE

RECOGNIZED.

EMPLOYER WILL LOOK AT THE

R‚SUM‚, NOT RECOGNIZING THE

NAMES OF DIFFERENT

UNIVERSITIES OR MAY QUESTION

WHETHER A DEGREE FROM THAT

COUNTRY REPRESENTS THE SAME

THING AS A DEGREE FROM HERE,

AND THAT SEED OF DOUBT IS

ENOUGH TO DENY THAT IMMIGRANT

A JOB.

IN ADDITION, THEY MAY NOT BE

FLUENT SPEAKERS OF ENGLISH,

BUT EVEN SO, A SLIGHT ACCENT

MAY GIVE A HINT, MAY SUGGEST

THAT THE PERSON'S COMMAND OF

THE LANGUAGE IS LESS THAN

PERFECT AND SO THAT PERSON

WILL BE DENIED HIS JOB.

AND SO AS A RESULT PEOPLE WHO,

IN THE HOME COUNTRY, ENJOYED

RESPECT, ECONOMIC SECURITY,

STATUS, HONOR AND JOBS THAT

ALLOWED THEM TO USE THE FULL

ARRAY OF THEIR SKILLS AND

TALENTS, IN THE HOST COUNTRY

OFTEN END UP IN JOBS THAT THEY

CONSIDER FAR BENEATH THEM IN

SOCIAL STATUS, ECONOMICALLY

AND PROFESSIONALLY.

ESPECIALLY IN THE BIGGER

CITIES, SUCH AS NEW YORK AND

MIAMI, YOU HAVE NURSES WORKING

AS HOTEL MAIDS; ENGINEERS

DRIVING TAXI CABS; AND LIKE

BEHRANI, AIR FORCE OFFICERS

PICKING TRASH AT THE SIDES OF

THE HIGHWAY.

SO WHAT DO SOME IMMIGRANTS DO?

WELL, A VERY COMMON ROUTE FOR

NEW IMMIGRANTS TO REGAIN THEIR

ECONOMIC AND SOCIAL STATUS IS

THROUGH ENTREPRENEURSHIP,

STARTING THEIR OWN BUSINESS.

SO WHEN THEY FIND THEMSELVES

SHUT OUT OF GOOD-PAYING JOBS,

THEY'LL START A BUSINESS

INSTEAD.

IMMIGRANTS IN FACT ARE MORE

LIKELY THAN NATIVE-BORN

AMERICANS TO START THEIR OWN

BUSINESSES.

AND THESE STATISTICS ARE A

LITTLE BIT OLDER, BUT THEY DID

SUGGEST A TREND.

IN 1995, 12% OF THE FASTEST

GROWING CORPORATIONS IN

AMERICA WERE COMPANIES STARTED

BY IMMIGRANTS.

AND IN FACT IMMIGRANTS HAVE

BECOME FAMOUS FOR THEIR

BUSINESS ENTERPRISES IN THE

UNITED STATES, AND SO

BEHRANI'S DESIRE TO START HIS

OWN TINY BUSINESS OF BUYING

AND SELLING HOMES TO REGAIN

ECONOMIC SECURITY AND SOME

STATUS FOR HIS FAMILY JUST

REPRESENTS ONE COMMON STRATEGY

OF CHASING THE AMERICAN DREAM.

NOW I WANT TO TALK ABOUT

CULTURE AS A SET OF MEANINGS

AND VALUES.

WHAT IS CULTURE?

CULTURE'S A SYSTEM OF BELIEFS

AND BEHAVIORS DERIVED FROM

THOSE BELIEFS AND I PLACE

EMPHASIS ON THE WORD "SYSTEM."

THESE BELIEFS AND VALUES THAT

COME FROM OUR CULTURE GIVE

MEANING TO OUR LIVES.

THEY PROVIDE OUR PHILOSOPHY, A

REASON FOR BEING, LIVING AND

ACTING.

TO QUOTE A FAMOUS

ANTHROPOLOGIST, ONE OF MY

FAVORITES, CLIFFORD GEERTZ, HE

WROTE THAT, QUOTE, "MAN IS AN

ANIMAL SUSPENDED IN WEBS OF

SIGNIFICANCE HE HIMSELF HAS

SPUN."

AND I TAKE CULTURE TO BE THOSE

WEBS.

SO THINK ABOUT A SPIDERWEB.

THINK ABOUT HOW EACH STRAND IS

A MEANING, AND ALL OF THAT

TOGETHER REPRESENTS OUR

CULTURE.

THEY GIVE MEANING TO OUR

LIVES.

BUT ALSO IMAGINE THAT WEB AS

BEING FRAGILE, ONE OF THOSE

STRANDS BREAKS AND THE MEANING

OF LIFE KIND OF FALLS AWAY.

SO THESE IDEAS, THESE MEANINGS

FROM OUR CULTURE GIVE US HOPE.

THEY TELL US THAT LIFE IS

WORTH LIVING, THAT THERE'S A

REASON TO GET OUT OF BED IN

THE MORNING AND PICK TRASH BY

THE SIDE OF THE HIGHWAY.

BUT WHEN THESE WEBS OF MEANING

BREAK AND THERE IS NO WAY TO

LIVE LIFE MEANINGFULLY, THEN

SUICIDE BECOMES AN OPTION.

SO LOOKING AT THESE

CHARACTERS, WHAT GIVES MEANING

TO THE LIVES OF COLONEL

BEHRANI AND KATHY NICOLO?

AND IN TRYING TO ANSWER THIS

QUESTION, I CAME TO THE

CONCLUSION THAT FAMILY IS

ACTUALLY CENTRAL FOR BOTH OF

THEM; BUT THE WAYS THAT THEY

IMAGINE FAMILY ARE COMPLETELY

DIFFERENT.

BEHRANI THINKS THAT HIS ROLE

AS A FATHER IS TO PROTECT THE

FAMILY'S HONOR, SAFETY AND

HAPPINESS.

SO HE COMMITS TO SPENDING

THOUSANDS OF DOLLARS EACH

MONTH ON AN APARTMENT THEY

CAN'T AFFORD, LEAVING THE

HOUSE EACH DAY DRESSED IN A

SUIT, ONLY TO CHANGE HIS

CLOTHES IN THE BATHROOM, ALL

TO ENSURE THAT SORAYA FINDS A

GOOD HUSBAND.

THEN HE HIDES FROM NADEREH AND

ESMAIL THE TRUTH ABOUT THE

HOUSE FOR AS LONG AS HE CAN.

HE WANTS TO PROTECTS THEM.

THE HOUSE REPRESENTS HIS LAST

CHANCE, THE LAST OF HIS LIFE

SAVINGS, HIS ONLY REMAINING

OPPORTUNITY TO SEND ESMAIL TO

COLLEGE.

HE HANGS ONTO THE HOUSE,

THEREFORE, EVEN TO THE POINT

OF TELLING HIS SON TO POINT

THE GUN AT LESTER'S HEART.

THAT'S KIND OF INDIRECTLY

CONTRIBUTING TO HIS SON'S

DEATH.

WE CAN DEBATE ABOUT THE

ULTIMATE MEANING OF THAT, BUT

THAT'S I THINK ONE WAY TO READ

IT.

KATHY IS ALSO DRIVEN BY A

VISION OF FAMILY, BUT FAMILY

FOR HER EVOKES A DIFFERENT SET

OF IMAGES.

FIRST SHE WANTS ROMANTIC LOVE

WITH A MAN.

IT'S A ROMANTIC KIND OF LOVE

THAT SHE'S SEEKING.

SO WHEN SHE THINKS ABOUT NICK

AND WHEN SHE THINKS ABOUT

LESTER, SHE-- WHAT DOES SHE

FOCUS ON?

SHE THINKS ABOUT MOMENTS OF

LOVEMAKING, AND SHE IMAGINES A

BOND THAT'S FORMED BETWEEN

THEM THROUGH THOSE ACTS.

WHEN SHE'S NOT WITH LESTER,

SHE WANTS TO BE WITH HIM, TO

KISS HIM AND TO MAKE LOVE TO

HIM.

SO BEHRANI EXPRESSES HIS LOVE

THROUGH PROTECTION; KATHY

THROUGH SEXUAL AFFECTION.

BUT THEN ALSO SHE HAS THIS

DESIRE FOR A CHILD.

AND IN FACT THE BREAKING POINT

IN HER MARRIAGE WAS THE FACT

THAT SHE WANTED A CHILD AND

NICK DIDN'T.

THEN AT THE END OF THE BOOK, I

DON'T KNOW IF YOU CAUGHT SOME

OF THIS, BUT I WAS FASCINATED

BY SOME OF THIS-- THESE

IMAGES.

THE END OF THE BOOK WHEN SHE

WAKES UP IN THE HOSPITAL,

AFTER HAVING WATCHED THE FILM,

I DIDN'T THINK SHE WAS GOING

TO WAKE UP IN THE HOSPITAL, SO

THIS WAS SURPRISING.

SHE WAKES UP IN THE HOSPITAL,

AND THE VERY FIRST THING THAT

CATCHES HER ATTENTION IS A BOY

NEXT-DOOR.

THERE'S A HOUSE NEXT TO THE

HOSPITAL AND SHE'S LOOKING

DOWN IT BELOW.

THERE'S A BOY NEXT DOOR

PLAYING IN A SANDBOX; AND

BETWEEN THE HOUSE AND THE

DECK, QUOTE, "A CHILD'S

PLASTIC WADING POOL COULD HAVE

HAD WITH SMILING, SPOUTING

BLUE WHALES, AND I WATCHED

FROM THE OTHER SIDE OF THE

FENCE, TWO STOREYS UP, EACH

SWALLOW, A HOOK IN THE

STITCHED BELLY OF MY THROAT."

THAT'S PAGE 348.

SO WHAT'S HURTING IS HER NECK

WOUNDS, BUT ALSO HER PAIN IS

CONNECTED TO THAT BOY AND THE

WHALES.

IT'S A HOOK THAT'S SINKING

INTO HER NECK.

THE FACT-- THEN THE MOTHER

GOES OVER TO THE BOY.

SHE LAUGHS WITH HIM, GETS THE

SAND OUT OF HIS HAIR.

THE BOY THEN, QUOTE, "THE

LITTLE BOY SAT WITH HIS BACK

TO THE FENCE AND THE HOSPITAL

ON THE OTHER SIDE."

SO THE BOY HAS HIS BACK TO

HER.

SHE'S LOOKING AT THE BOY'S

BACK.

THAT WAS KIND OF A SYMBOL OF

THE FACT THAT SHE REALIZES

THAT IS NOT SOMETHING SHE'S

EVER GOING TO HAVE.

THEN, WHEN SHE LEAVES THE

HOSPITAL, WHEN SHE'S BEING

TAKEN AWAY IN HANDCUFFS, THAT

BOY IS HER LAST IMAGE.

WHERE IS IT?

QUOTE, "HIS MOTHER SMILING

DOWN AT HIM."

THIS IS PAGE 357.

"SHE WIPES THE SAND OFF HIS

HANDS AND LIFTED HIM ONTO HER

LAP.

THE DOOR OPENED BEHIND ME AS

THE POLICEMAN COMING IN, BUT I

DIDN'T TURN AROUND."

SHE'S SO FOCUSED ON THE BOY.

"THE OFFICER," QUOTE, "TOOK MY

WRISTS AND SLIPPED THE COOL

METAL OF HIS HANDCUFFS ONTO

THEM.

I COULDN'T SEE THE BOY'S FACE

ANYMORE, AND IN THE HOURS AND

DAYS THAT FOLLOWED, I WOULD

THINK OF HIM."

THOSE ARE THE LAST IMAGES--

THE MOMENT SHE WAKES UP IN THE

HOSPITAL AND HER LAST IMAGES

OF LEAVING THE HOSPITAL BEFORE

GOING TO PRISON.

NOW THE HOSPITAL'S ALSO A

SYMBOL OF HER FATHER.

WHILE HER MOTHER AND HER

BROTHER JUDGE HER, SHE STILL

HANGS ONTO THIS IDEA OF HER

DECEASED FATHER.

WHEN SHE WAS A CHILD, HE

DIDN'T HAVE MUCH TIME AND

ATTENTION FOR HER.

SHE APPEARS TO BE TRYING TO

HANG ONTO HIM AND THE

AFFECTION SHE NEVER GOT FROM

HIM BY HANGING ONTO HIS HOUSE.

SO WHEN THE WEBS OF

SIGNIFICANCE THAT GAVE MEANING

TO THEIR LIVES BREAK AND THEIR

LIVES NO LONGER HAVE PURPOSE,

SUICIDE IS THE OPTION FOR BOTH

OF THEM.

BEHRANI CAN NO LONGER PROTECT

ESMAIL; HE'S DEAD, AND HE

CANNOT PROTECT NADI FROM WHAT

WOULD SURELY BE THE GREATEST

SADNESS OF HER LIFE, HAVING

LOST HER SON.

KATHY'S CRASH COMES EARLIER.

SHE BEGINS TO FALL INTO A

SLUMP WHEN NICK LEFT HER.

SHE'S GIVEN HOPE AGAIN WHEN

SHE MEETS LESTER, BUT WHEN SHE

THINKS THAT HE'S RETURNED TO

HIS FAMILY, SHE DESCENDS INTO

THIS BLACK PIT OF DESPAIR AND

SHE TRIES TWICE TO KILL

HERSELF.

BUT CULTURE DOES MORE THAN

GIVE MEANING TO OUR LIFE'S

PROJECTS.

IT ALSO SHAPES HOW WE VIEW

OTHERS.

SO IT'S LIKE A SORT OF LENSES

OVER YOUR EYES.

CULTURE GIVES MEANING TO

THINGS OUT THERE, SO WE SEE--

WE INTERPRET OTHER PEOPLE'S

BEHAVIOR IN TERMS OF THE

MEANINGS THAT WE HAVE OVER OUR

EYES.

SO BEHRANI AND KATHY

REPEATEDLY MISUNDERSTAND ONE

ANOTHER BECAUSE THEY DON'T

UNDERSTAND THE MEANINGS BEHIND

ONE ANOTHER'S ACTIONS.

SO BEHRANI, FOR EXAMPLE, HIS

LIFE IN IRAN AND HIS

EXPERIENCES-- THE AIR FORCE

GAVE HIM A SENSE THAT A GOOD

LIFE IS A LIFE OF DISCIPLINE,

SO HE SEES AMERICANS'

OVERWEIGHT BODIES AND

TELEVISION VIEWING AND

CONSUMERISM AND HE VIEWS THEM

AS WEAK AND UNDISCIPLINED AND

GREEDY.

THERE'S THAT GREAT QUOTE ON

PAGE 124 ABOUT WATCHING

AMERICANS-- SEEING AMERICANS

WATCH TELEVISION, AND THIS

PERHAPS, QUOTE, "EXPLAINS THE

FACE OF AMERICANS, THE EYES

THAT NEVER APPEAR SATISFIED.

THESE PEOPLE HAVE THE EYES OF

VERY SMALL CHILDREN WHO ARE

FOREVER LOOKING FOR THEIR NEXT

SOURCE OF DISTRACTION,

ENTERTAINMENT OR A SWEET TASTE

IN THE MOUTH."

AND WHEN HE SEES KATHY IN

PARTICULAR, HE SEES A WOMAN

THAT LACKED THE DISCIPLINE

NECESSARY TO HANG ONTO HER

HOUSE, AND HE SEES A WHORE,

QUOTE-UNQUOTE, A WOMAN WEARING

CHEAP MAKEUP, SHORTS, NO SHOES

AND HAVING AN AFFAIR WITH A

MARRIED MAN.

SIMILARLY KATHY MISUNDERSTANDS

BEHRANI.

SHE CALLS HIM AN ARAB.

SHE CONSIDERS HIM CHAUVINISTIC

FOR HIDING THE TRUTH ABOUT THE

HOUSE FROM HIS WIFE.

SHE SEES WHAT SHE CALLS HIS

TEMPER AND ENCOURAGES LESTER

TO GO THROUGH WITH THE PLAN TO

FORCE BEHRANI TO SELL THE

HOUSE BACK TO THE COUNTY.

THAT POINT IS-- IF YOU

REMEMBER LESTER'S PULLING

BACK.

HE SAYS WE CAN'T GO THROUGH

WITH THIS, AND SHE SAYS, NO,

YOU HAVEN'T SEEN HIS TEMPER.

HE WON'T LET THIS GO.

SHE SEES HIS ACTIONS AS

STEMMING FROM GREED RATHER

THAN A DESIRE TO PROVIDE FOR

HIS FAMILY IN THIS LAST-DITCH

EFFORT.

SO ULTIMATELY THE CHARACTERS

ARE DOOMED TO A HORRIBLE

ENTANGLEMENT.

EACH HOLDS ON TO THE HOUSE AS

A SYMBOL OF ALL OF THEIR

DESIRES, BEHRANI TO PROTECT

AND SUPPORT HIS FAMILY AND

KATHY, STRUGGLING HARD TO WIN

THE LOVE OF A MAN, HER FATHER,

NICK, LESTER, THIS DREAM OF A

SON, ANYONE.

THEY DO NOT UNDERSTAND THE

MEANINGS BEHIND THEIR ACTIONS;

THEY IMAGINE THE WORST OF ONE

ANOTHER, AND THEY STRUGGLE TO

THE DEATH.

THAT'S IT FROM ME.

(Applause)

>> Elena: CAN YOU HEAR ME NOW?

BETTER.

OKAY.

AT THE BEGINNING, I WANTED TO

SHARE SORT OF A PIECE OF

GOSSIP WITH YOU.

RUMOR HAS IT THAT THE AUTHOR

DUBUS BECAME FAMOUS.

HE WAS APPROACHED BY 150 FILM

DIRECTORS ASKING FOR HIS

PERMISSION TO TURN "THE HOUSE

OF SAND AND FOG" INTO FILM,

AND HE TURNED ALL OF THEM

DOWN.

WHEN ASKED FOR AN EXPLANATION,

HE SAID TWO THINGS.

FIRST, HE DIDN'T THINK HOW HE

COULD DO A GOOD JOB, AND MOST

IMPORTANTLY HE SAID HE DIDN'T

WANT THE FILM TO BE REDUCED TO

A DIGESTIBLE BIG MAC VERSION

OF THE BOOK.

AND SO IT WENT.

UNTIL ONE DAY HE GOT A PHONE

CALL FROM A YOUNG AND

COMPLETELY UNKNOWN DIRECTOR,

VADIM PERELMAN, A FILM SCHOOL

DROPOUT, ACTUALLY, AN

IMMIGRANT FROM THE FORMER

SOVIET UNION.

THEY TALKED FOR AN HOUR AND A

HALF ON THE PHONE, AND

SOMETIME LATER A WONDERFUL

FILM WAS BORN.

WHY AM I TELLING YOU THIS?

WE ARE NOT HERE TO TALK ABOUT

THE FILM, AND PROFESSOR MARK

PRICE IS GOING TO DO THAT NEXT

TIME.

BUT THERE'S A POINT TO MY

STORY.

WHEN ASKED WHY HE LIKED THE

NOVEL SO MUCH, THE RUSSIAN

DIRECTOR, PERELMAN, SAID:

"THIS NOVEL IS ABOUT BEING AN

IMMIGRANT IN A NEW COUNTRY AND

FEELING LIKE AN IMMIGRANT IN

YOUR OWN COUNTRY."

AND THIS QUOTE I THINK

CHARACTERIZES THE NOVEL VERY

WELL.

I HAVE TO SAY I WAS AMONG THE

GROUP OF FACULTY WHO

RECOMMENDED THIS NOVEL FOR RIT

STUDENTS.

SO IF YOU DON'T LIKE IT, YOU

CAN BLAME ME.

WHY DID I ADVOCATE FOR IT?

AFTER ALL, THERE WERE QUITE A

FEW VERY LEGITIMATE CONCERNS.

THE NOVEL IS RATHER DARK AND

DISTURBING.

THERE IS DESPAIR, DEPRESSION,

DRUGS, ALCOHOL AND PORN

ADDICTIONS, DOMESTIC VIOLENCE

AND FINALLY MURDER AND

SUICIDE.

THERE IS CERTAINLY NO LIGHT AT

THE END OF THE TUNNEL, AND YET

PRECISELY FOR THESE VERY

REASONS THAT THE NOVEL

APPEALED TO ME.

I ADMITTED TO MYSELF THAT MY

CHOICE WAS AFFECTED BY THE

FACTS OF BEING AN IMMIGRANT

MYSELF.

I CAME HERE FROM RUSSIA ELEVEN

YEARS AGO, AND I JUST HAVE TO

TELL YOU A LITTLE BIT ABOUT

THE RELATIONSHIP BETWEEN THE

RUSSIANS AND THE WRITERS.

RUSSIANS LOVE THEIR WRITERS.

THEY ELEVATE THEM TO THE STATE

OF PROPHETS, ASSIGN THE TASK

OF CARRYING THE WORD, THE

TRUTH TO THE PEOPLE.

DURING THE YEARS, THE

GOVERNMENT USED THE WRITER'S

VOICE FOR PROPAGATING ITS OWN

POLITICAL GOALS.

IT OFFICIALLY MADE THE WRITERS

ENGINEERS OF HUMAN SOULS.

AND SO THE WRITERS WERE

REQUIRED TO PRESENT LIFE

THROUGH A CERTAIN REQUIRED

ARTISTIC METHOD, WHICH WAS

CALLED SOCIALIST REALISM.

IT MEANT FALSE IDEALIZATION OF

SOVIET REALITY, BUT NOT ALL

THE WRITERS COULD BRING

THEMSELVES TO EXCHANGE MORAL

AND ARTISTIC INTEGRITY FOR A

LAVISH LIFESTYLE THAT THE

SOVIET GOVERNMENT WAS SO READY

TO BESTOW UPON THEM.

SO THOSE WHO COULDN'T HAD

THREE CHOICES: SILENCE, FORCED

LABOR CAMP, OR DEATH.

AND SO MOST CHOSE TO WRITE IN

A REAL WAY.

SO WHAT IS IT THAT THEY WROTE

ABOUT THAT CARRIED THE

HARSHEST CRIMINAL PENALTY IN

THE SOVIET UNION?

THEY WROTE ABOUT UNIVERSAL

THEMES, SUCH AS HUMAN

WEAKNESS, ABSURDITY AND PAIN.

THEY WROTE ABOUT PEOPLE'S

ISOLATION AND MUTUAL

INCOMPREHENSION, AND TO SOME

EXTENT THAT IS WHAT I FIND IN

"THE HOUSE OF SAND AND FOG."

I'M SURE YOU DISCUSSED IN YOUR

CLASSES THAT ANDRE DUBUS USES

BEHRANI AS A VEHICLE FOR THE

CRITIQUE OF AMERICAN CULTURE,

CULTURE OF INSTANT

GRATIFICATION.

IT SHOWS THAT KATHY, WHO

APPEARS TO BE SADLY AND

HOPELESSLY IGNORANT.

IT IS VERY SIGNIFICANT THAT

SHE IS THE ONLY CHARACTER IN

THE ENTIRE NOVEL WHO

CONTINUOUSLY MISPRONOUNCES THE

BEHRANIS' LAST NAME AND REFERS

TO THEM AS ARABS, IRANIANS OR

ISRAELIS, ALL OF WHICH ARE THE

SAME EMPTY NOTIONS TO HER.

OUT OF TOUCH WITH THE WORLD,

ALIENATED FROM EVERYTHING AND

EVERYONE, KATHY LEADS ON THE

FRUITS OF HER PARENTS'

GENERATION.

I FIND THAT SHE ALSO PERFECTLY

ILLUSTRATES MANY CULTURES'

FAVORITE PSYCHOANALYTICAL

LOOPHOLE: BLAMING YOUR MOTHER

FOR EVERYTHING THAT GOES WRONG

IN YOUR ADULT LIFE.

(Laughter)

KATHY ENJOYS THE VICTIM MODE.

SHE BLAMES EVERYONE ELSE FOR

HER MISFORTUNES WHILE MAKING A

VICTIM OF EVERYONE IN HER

PAST.

BUT THE NOVEL IS OBJECTIVE AND

IT'S BALANCED.

IT SHOWS BEHRANI ABSORBED IN

THE TYPICAL IMMIGRANT PURSUIT,

CHASTISING HIS NEW FELLOW

COUNTRYMEN FOR THE SAME THINGS

HE HIMSELF IS GUILTY OF.

A POPULAR SELF-DEFENSE

MECHANISM OF SOMEONE UPROOTED

AND TRANSPLANTED TO THE NEW

SOIL, THAT NO MATTER HOW HARD

ONE TRIES DOES NOT FEEL QUITE

THE SAME.

AND SO "THE HOUSE OF SAND AND

FOG" ALLOWS US TO GET AN

INTIMATE VIEW OF THE LIVES OF

THREE VERY TROUBLED HUMAN

BEINGS.

HE ALSO SHOWS THAT NO MATTER

WHAT OUR GEOGRAPHIC, ETHNIC OR

CULTURAL ROOTS ARE, WE TRAVEL

THE SAME DIFFICULT ROADS OF

DEPRESSION, ADDICTION,

SELF-DOUBT AND UNDERESTIMATION

OF OUR SELF-WORTH.

COMMENTING ON "THE HOUSE OF

SAND AND FOG" SAYS, IT SHOWS

WE ALL FALL INTO BAD

RELATIONSHIPS AND FAIL TO WORK

ON THE GOOD ONES, THAT WE NEED

OUTSIDE APPROVAL AND RESPECT;

WE NEED TO BE LOVED, AND WE

ALL SET INFLEXIBLE LIFE GOALS

THAT WE FEEL COMPELLED TO MEET

OR RISK BEING LABELED A

FAILURE.

WE USUALLY ALL UNDERESTIMATE

OUR SUCCESS IN LIFE AND FAIL

TO GIVE OURSELVES CREDIT FOR

THE INSURMOUNTABLE HURDLES

THAT WE SOMETIMES NAVIGATE TO

GET THERE.

AND SO BEHRANI, KATHY AND

LESTER FOUND THEMSELVES UP AND

DOWN THOSE ROADS.

AND THERE IS A COLLISION, A

DESTRUCTIVE COLLISION, THAT

ENDS ALL HOPE FOR A REMOTELY

HAPPY ENDING.

AS A READER, YOU KNOW THAT YOU

IDENTIFY WITH EVERYONE AND NO

ONE.

THE CHARACTERS ARE NOT

PARTICULARLY LIKABLE, BUT THEY

ALL SEEM WORTHY OF SYMPATHY,

IN PART BECAUSE THEY REMAIN

CAPABLE OF SHOWING IT.

BEHRANI, LESTER AND KATHY ALL

HOLD ONTO COMPASSION AND

DECENCY AND EVEN SHOW THE

SIGNS OF A WILLINGNESS TO

RELENT.

AND SO THE NOVEL SEEKS TO

UNDERSTAND HOW IT IS THAT THE

STORY COMES DOWN TO SUCH A

CATASTROPHIC RESULT.

AND I THINK IT SHOWS VERY WELL

THAT WHAT WREAKS HAVOC IS

MISGUIDED BEHAVIOR AND NOT A

MALIGNANT ONE.

SO THE NOVEL COMES TO THE END,

AND IT PUTS THE READER THROUGH

THE TORTURE OF WITNESSING

ESMAIL'S DEATH AND BEHRANI'S

UNIMAGINABLE GRIEF.

ANDRE DUBUS LEAVES US

COMPLETELY ON OUR OWN, WITHOUT

SUGGESTING ANY KIND OF

OTHERWORLDLY OR EMOTIONAL WAY

OUT.

WITH HUMAN SUFFERING, THE

NOVEL SEEMS TO LET THE READER

DOWN AS IT PROVIDES NO REAL

CLOSURE IN REGARDS TO VIOLENCE

COMMITTED AGAINST THE MOST

VULNERABLE AND INNOCENT.

I WOULD LIKE TO DRAW A

PARALLEL HERE.

THERE IS A NOVEL CALLED "BEND

SINISTER."

THE NOVEL WAS WRITTEN BY THE

RUSSIAN-AMERICAN AUTHOR

NABOKOV.

IN THE NOVEL, THE FATHER LOSES

HIS YOUNG SON.

HE'S MUTE WITH GRIEF, JUST

LIKE BEHRANI AT SOME POINT,

AND HE LOOKS AT HIS CHILD'S

LIFELESS BODY.

IN THE RUSSIAN NOVEL, HOWEVER,

THE AUTHOR COMES TO THE

FATHER'S RESCUE AND

MERCILESSLY ALLOWS HIS

CHARACTER TO LOSE HIS MIND.

HIS INDUCED MADNESS TAKES THE

FORM OF REALIZATION THAT HE

AND HIS WORLD ARE MERELY THE

INCONSEQUENTIAL CREATIONS OF

THE AUTHOR, WHO IS SHAPING THE

NARRATIVE.

AND THUS THE NOVEL IS

MERCIFULLY AND ABRUPTLY

INTERRUPTED.

BEHRANI IS NOT AWARDED THIS

LUXURY, AND HE FINDS HIS OWN

WAY, THE ONLY ONE HE THINKS OF

AT THE TIME, AND THE ENDING IS

UNSETTLING.

WHAT DOES ANDRE DUBUS THINK OF

THE ENDING?

HE SAYS, QUOTE: "IT'S A TRAGIC

ENDING.

IT'S BRUTAL AND IT'S HARSH,

AND I THINK IT'S PROBABLY EVEN

AN OFFENSIVE ENDING, BUT I

THINK ONE OF THE JOBS OF THE

WRITER IS TO TAKE US THROUGH A

NIGHTMARE WE DON'T NECESSARILY

HAVE TO LIVE OURSELVES."

AND I THINK THE NOVEL DOES

ACCOMPLISH THAT.

HAUNTING OUR IMAGINATION WITH

THE GRAPHIC IMAGES EVERY

SUICIDE, THE NOVEL URGES US TO

ACKNOWLEDGE THAT THE ISSUE OF

SUFFERING CANNOT AND SHOULD

NOT BRING EMOTIONAL OR

INTELLECTUAL CLOSURE.

THERE'S A LINE FROM HEMINGWAY

THAT I WANT TO SHARE WITH YOU.

HEMINGWAY AT SOME POINT SAID,

"THE JOB OF THE WRITER IS NOT

TO JUDGE BUT TO SEEK TO

UNDERSTAND, AND SEEKING TO

UNDERSTAND IS WHAT I HOPED MY

STUDENTS WOULD TAKE AWAY FROM

THE NOVEL.

THANK YOU.

(Applause)

>> WE'LL TAKE QUESTIONS.

>> OR COMMENTS.

IF ANYBODY WANTS TO SAY WHAT

THEY THOUGHT ABOUT THE NOVEL

OR DISAGREE WITH ANYTHING THAT

WE MIGHT HAVE SAID OR SHARE

SOMETHING NEW.

>> I WANT TO THANK YOU ALL SO

MUCH FOR HELPING ME PREPARE MY

LECTURE FOR NEXT WEEK.

(Laughter)

SO BEHRANI...

>> AN EXILE IN THE PROCESS OF

TRYING TO BECOME AN IMMIGRANT.

THAT'S, I THINK, PRECISELY

HIM.

>> ...YOUR COMMENT ABOUT KATHY

BEING RESPONSIBLE... SO MANY

OF YOUR IDEAS, ELENA

(Inaudible)

BUT...

>> I THINK BEHRANI WAS

ACTUALLY HOLDING ONTO THE IDEA

OF THE HOUSE--

>> YOU MENTIONED KATHY.

>> RIGHT.

RESPONSIBLE FOR UPPING THE

ANTE OF THE TRAGIC

CONSEQUENCES OF THE STORY.

>> OH, ABSOLUTELY.

YEAH, I DIDN'T HAVE TIME TO

TALK ABOUT LESTER.

BUT IF I WERE TO SAY WHAT'S

GOING ON WITH LESTER, IT WOULD

BE SOMETHING ABOUT THE GUILT

HE'S FEELING FOR LEAVING HIS

FAMILY AND HIS DESIRE TO SAVE

THE DAMSEL IN DISTRESS.

HE'S GOT TO RECUPERATE HIS

NOTION OF HIMSELF AS THE HERO

IN HIS OWN LIFE, SO HE'S GOING

TO SAVE THIS DAMSEL NO MATTER

WHAT IT TAKES.

>> IF WE COULD JUST HAVE

ANYBODY ASK ANY QUESTIONS, IF

YOU COULD JUST RAISE YOUR HAND

FOR THE MICROPHONE BECAUSE THE

CAPTIONIST CANNOT HEAR.

WE ASK YOU TO USE THE

MICROPHONE.

IT'S ALSO BEING RECORDED.

SO IF YOU GUYS COULD JUST

RAISE YOUR HAND AND I'LL BRING

THE MICROPHONE TO YOU.

>> FIRST YOU HAVE TO RAISE

YOUR HAND.

>> YEAH.

>> THANK YOU, OF COURSE FOR

THE VERY INTERESTING

PRESENTATIONS.

WHAT KIND OF COMPELLED ME TO

ASK THIS QUESTION WAS THE

NOTION OF SOME KIND OF

MOVEMENT THAT YOU EXPERIENCE

AS YOU GO FROM ONE PLACE TO

ANOTHER AND CONFRONT DIFFERENT

WAYS OF LIVING AND IN VARIOUS

PLACES.

PROFESSOR KRAY WAS KIND OF

TRYING TO POINT THIS OUT AS AN

ANTHROPOLOGIST, CULTURE, TOO,

PERHAPS SUPER IMPOSE DIFFERENT

VIEWS THAT WE ACCRUE OVER TIME

AND IN DIFFERENT PLACES.

I REALLY ENJOYED PROFESSOR

ELAHI'S KIND OF, YOU KNOW,

ETHNOGRAPHY, SPEAKING ABOUT

HIS EXPERIENCE MOVING THROUGH

THESE DIFFERENT PLACES.

AND I THINK ALL THREE OF YOU

PROBABLY CAN GIVE FASCINATING

TRANS-NATIONAL PERSPECTIVES ON

WHAT IT MEANS TO BE SO MOBILE

AT THE BEGINNING OF THE 21st

CENTURY.

SO MY QUESTION IS THIS: WHAT

DOES IT MEAN TO BE AN AMERICAN

WHEN YOU ARE AT THE CENTER, IN

SOME WAYS, OF THIS MOBILITY

FOR THE REST OF THE WORLD?

WHAT DOES IT MEAN TO BE AN

IMMIGRANT-SLASH-CITIZEN?

AS MANY OF US ARE.

BUT I THINK FOR THE

NON-NATURALIZED CITIZENS, MANY

OF US ARE BEGINNING TO

CONSIDER.

AT THE BEGINNING OF THE 21st

CENTURY, THE PEOPLE WHO ARE

LOSING THEIR JOBS TO THE

GLOBAL ECONOMY ARE DOING SO AT

WAL-MARTS THAT ARE FUELING

THEIR OWN DEMISE.

THEY ARE LITERALLY TRAPPED

WITHIN A CYCLE OF CONSUMPTION

THAT IS MAKING THEM OBSOLETE.

>> SOMEBODY SAID, REALLY?

DO YOU WANT TO EXPLAIN WHAT

YOU MEAN?

I THINK I KNOW WHAT YOU'RE

GETTING AT.

>> WAL-MART.

WHO SHOPS AT WAL-MART?

(Laughter)

THE LARGEST CORPORATION IN

AMERICA THIS YEAR.

IT'S THE WORLD'S LARGEST

RETAILER.

>> LARGEST HERE OR IN MEXICO?

>> WHERE ARE THESE JOBS GOING?

WHERE DO THESE PRODUCTS COME

FROM?

WE'RE A POST-INDUSTRIAL

SOCIETY.

MANUFACTURING BASES HAVE

SHIFTED GLOBALLY.

>> I'D LIKE TO TIE THAT BACK

TO WHAT BABAK WAS POINTING OUT

ABOUT WHY HIS GENERATION IS

NOT REPRESENTED IN THE NOVEL,

AND I THINK HE WAS GETTING

AT-- HE MENTIONED ESMAIL WAS A

LITTLE MORE SYMPATHETIC TO

KATHY BECAUSE HE COULD PERHAPS

SEE THINGS FROM HER

PERSPECTIVE A LITTLE BIT.

IF CULTURE'S A SET OF LENSES

THROUGH WHICH WE SEE THE

WORLD, BUT NOW CULTURES ARE

BLENDING, COLLIDING, COMING

TOGETHER.

EACH OF US IS ABLE TO KIND OF

TAKE ON-- OR TAKE OFF AND PUT

ON OTHER LENSES, IF ONLY TO A

CERTAIN DEGREE.

WE SEE THEM THROUGH THEM

NEARSIGHTEDLY OR SOMETHING.

THIS IS GETTING TO BE A REALLY

EXTENDED AND GROSS METAPHOR.

BUT YOU'RE RIGHT, MAYBE--

MAYBE, AT TIMES AT LEAST,

WE'RE ABLE TO STEP OUT OF

OURSELVES AND PUT OURSELVES IN

SOMEONE ELSE'S POSITION AND

TRY TO SEE THE WORLD AS THEY

DO.

SO MAYBE WE END UP BEING NOT

CHAMELEONS BUT MAYBE

MULTIFACETED PEOPLE WITH

DIFFERENT-- WITH DIFFERENT

FACES, DIFFERENT SETS OF

PERSPECTIVES BUT THAT SHIFT

UNEVENLY.

IT'S NEVER GOING TO BE EASY.

NONE OF US CAN SAY THAT WE CAN

IMMEDIATELY JUST STEP INTO THE

PERSPECTIVE OF AN IRANIAN AND

WHAT'S THAT LIKE BUT MAYBE WE

CAN GET GLIMPSES OF IT.

MAYBE.

I DON'T KNOW.

THAT'S OPTIMISTIC READING.

>> IF I CAN KEY IN ON ANOTHER

THREAD OF WHAT YOU SAID, WHICH

IS THE WORD YOU BEGAN WITH,

MOVEMENT, AND ONE OF THE

THINGS I LEFT OUT OF MY TALK

THAT I WAS THINKING ABOUT AS I

WAS PUTTING IT TOGETHER WAS

NOT JUST THE MOVEMENT OF

IMMIGRANTS BUT THE MOVEMENT OF

CAPITAL IN THE ECONOMIC SENSE

AND OF, YOU KNOW, IN THE CASE

OF IRAN, IT'S NATURAL

RESOURCES, SO THAT, YOU KNOW,

I NARRATED MY OWN TRAVEL

ACROSS THE ATLANTIC TO ENGLAND

AND THEN TO THE UNITED STATES,

IN THE ABSENCE OF THAT

STRUCTURAL RELATIONSHIP

BETWEEN THE UNITED STATES AND

IRAN, RIGHT?

SO THAT, EVEN BEFORE I WAS

BORN, PROBABLY AROUND THE TIME

MY BROTHER WAS BORN IN '53,

THERE WAS AN EVENT THAT KIND

OF PUT IN PLACE WHAT WOULD

HAPPEN FOR THE NEXT 50 YEARS

IN IRAN, WHICH WAS THE COUP

D'ETAT AGAINST MOHAMMED

MOSSAD.

SO HOW IS IT I CAME TO THE

UNITED STATES?

PARTLY I KIND OF FOLLOWED THAT

PIPELINE OF PRODUCT.

NOT-- YOU KNOW, MY FAMILY

DIDN'T LEAVE BECAUSE OF THE

REVOLUTION BUT WE PERHAPS

STAYED BECAUSE OF THE

REVOLUTION, AND THE REVOLUTION

WAS A REACTION TO THOSE EVENTS

OF '53 AND SO, YOU KNOW,

MATERIAL CONCERNS LINK UP WITH

THESE CULTURAL CONCERNS, AND

SOME WOULD ARGUE STRUCTURE

THEN COMPLETELY AND THERE'S NO

WAY OUT.

OTHERS WOULD SAY, WELL, THEY

ARE POSSIBILITIES TO

CONSTRUCT, TO CREATE OTHER

STRUCTURES.

THE EXAMPLE OF THE WEB OF

CULTURE THAT PROFESSOR KRAY

USED AND THE LOOM THAT WEAVES

A CULTURE ACROSS DIFFERENT

SETTINGS THAT I BORROWED FROM

FISHER AND ABETTI.

YEAH, I DON'T KNOW.

IT'S A TOUGH QUESTION.

(Chuckling)

OTHER COMMENTS, QUESTIONS?

WE MUST HAVE REALLY COVERED

ALL THE BASES.

>> Elena: I THINK MAYBE TO GET

YOU GUYS GOING A LITTLE BIT,

YOU COULD JUST SAY WHETHER OR

NOT YOU LIKED THE NOVEL, AND

IF YOU DISLIKED IT VERY MUCH,

YOU COULD SAY WHY, AND IF YOU

REALLY ENJOYED IT, YOU COULD

SAY-- GO AHEAD.

>> SHOW ME YOUR HAND.

>> I JUST HAVE A QUESTION

ABOUT THE CONNECTION BETWEEN

AIRPLANES AND IRANIANS.

WHERE THAT WAS COMING FROM?

>> IT WAS REALLY A--

>> NOT ALL IRANIANS ARE

TERRORISTS.

>> CORRECT.

IT WAS REALLY A GUIDING

STRUCTURE FOR MY TALK; BUT IT

TOUCHES ON THAT MOBILITY, AND

I WAS PLAYING A LITTLE BIT ON

YOUR EXPECTATIONS OF IRANIANS

AND AIRPLANES, BUT OBVIOUSLY

THERE'S A STEREOTYPE THERE.

>> ONE THING THAT I DON'T

THINK YOU MENTIONED DIRECTLY

BUT I KEPT THINKING AS THE

THREE OF YOU ARE GOING THROUGH

YOUR TALK IS THE FLEXIBILITY

OF CHILDREN WHEN THEY ARE

MOVING FROM ONE CULTURE TO

ANOTHER.

YOU COMMENTED ON THE SON BEING

A TEENAGER, HAD COME TO THIS

COUNTRY PROBABLY JUST AROUND

PUBERTY AND SEEMED TO BE ABLE

TO ASSIMILATE MORE EASILY AND

YET NOT LOSE HIS IRANIAN

CULTURE.

BABAK, YOU MENTIONED YOUR

OLDER BROTHERS SEEMED LESS

ABLE OR LESS COMFORTABLE IN

THE UNITED STATES THAN PERHAPS

YOU ARE.

SO I WONDERED IF YOU-- ANY OR

ALL OF YOU COMMENT ON THE

FLEXIBILITY OF CHILDREN AS YOU

SAW IT IN THE NOVEL OR AS YOU

SEE IT FROM YOUR OWN

EXPERIENCE GOING FROM ONE

COUNTRY TO ANOTHER?

>> CHILDREN, ESPECIALLY

PRELINGUISTIC CHILDREN, BEFORE

THEY'VE BEGUN TO SPEAK A

LANGUAGE, ARE CULTURAL

SPONGES.

YOU TAKE THEM OUT OF ONE

ENVIRONMENT AND POP THEM IN

ANOTHER AND THEY WILL

COMPLETELY ABSORB THE NEW

CULTURE THAT SURROUNDS THEM.

>> Elena: I WORKED AS A COURT

INTERPRETER FOR ROCHESTER FOR

ABOUT TEN YEARS, AND SO I

WOULD INTERPRET FOR THE

IMMIGRANTS, FOR THE RUSSIAN

IMMIGRANTS WHO NEEDED TO BE IN

COURT FOR A VARIETY OF

REASONS.

AND SO I CAME ACROSS QUITE A

FEW STORIES AS I DID MY

INTERPRETING.

AND SO WHAT I WITNESSED IS,

YES, PRELINGUISTIC CHILDREN,

ABSOLUTELY, THEY ARE SPONGES

AND THEY GET COMPLETELY

AMERICANIZED AND ARE QUITE

COMFORTABLE.

BUT AFTER A CERTAIN AGE, I

THINK OUTWARDLY, ON THE

SURFACE, IT APPEARS TO BE A

COMPLETE ASSIMILATION, BUT IT

COMES AT A VERY HIGH PRICE.

YOU SEE KIDS FROM PROFESSIONAL

FAMILIES WITH NO DISCORD OR

ANY KIND OF MARITAL PROBLEMS

OR PROBLEMS OTHERWISE TO DO

SILLY LITTLE THINGS IN ORDER

TO FIT IN WITH THEIR PEERS,

LIKE GOING TO WEGMAN'S AND

JUST BECAUSE THE KID SAID

STEALING A PACK OF CIGARETTES

AND THEN BEING ARRESTED AND

BROUGHT TO COURT, AND THINGS

ESCALATE FROM THERE.

I THINK THAT DESIRE TO FIT IN

SO MUCH COMES SOMETIMES AT A

VERY HIGH PRICE FOR THOSE

KIDS.

>> ARE YOU THE ONLY MIC?

>> YOU NEED ANOTHER

MICROPHONE.

>> THERE IS ANOTHER ONE.

>> BEING AN IMMIGRANT MYSELF,

I KIND OF HAVE PERSPECTIVE OF

MY OWN BUT I JUST WANTED TO

FINDS OUT YOUR POINT OF VIEW,

ASSIMILATION WITH A HOST

COUNTRY AND KIND OF BRANDING

INTO THE SOCIAL STANDPOINT,

YOU KNOW, FROM WHEN YOU COME

TO-- FROM A DIFFERENT COUNTRY

YOU HAVE TO SORT OF LIKE BLEND

IN, IF YOU KNOW WHAT I MEAN.

WOULD YOU SAY THAT IT'S MORE

RELATED TO THE SAND OR TO THE

FOG?

>> OH.

WOW.

THAT'S DEEP.

>> AH.

(Laughter)

TOO METAPHORICAL FOR ME.

>> COMBINATION OF BOTH?

>> YEAH, YEAH.

WELL, HOW ARE YOU THINKING OF

THIS IN TERMS OF SAND AND FOG?

>> EXPLAIN TO US FIRST.

(Laughter)

>> PERFECT STRATEGY OF ALL

PEOPLE.

WE DON'T KNOW HOW TO ANSWER A

QUESTION, WE THROW IT BACK TO

YOU.

>> WELL, I WAS THINKING ABOUT

A COMBINATION OF BOTH.

BASICALLY IT'S LIKE A COP BIN

NATION OF BOTH FROM MY

PERSPECTIVE BUT WITH A

DIFFERENT PROPORTION FOR EVERY

PERSON.

>> SO WHAT DO YOU MEAN BY SAND

AND FOG?

>> SAND AND FOG, THE SAND IS

LIKE A STRUGGLE, BASICALLY

THAT YOU CAN'T JUST GO THROUGH

IT EASILY, AND YOU GET SUNK IN

BY IT.

AND THE FOG IS BASICALLY THE

UNCERTAINTY AND THE KIND OF

LIKE BASICALLY YOU'RE GUIDED

ONLY BY HOPE AND YOU DON'T

REALLY KNOW WHAT'S AHEAD OF

YOU.

>> OH, WOW.

>> HAVE HIM TEACH OUR NEXT

CLASS.

>> YEAH, THAT'S GREAT.

THAT'S FANTASTIC.

(Laughter)

>> WELL, THE FOG, YOU KNOW,

THOSE ARE FLEXIBLE METAPHORS.

SOMETIMES THE FOG APPLIES TO

ONE CHARACTER.

OTHER TIMES A DIFFERENT

CHARACTER.

I MEAN THE WAY I READ THE SAND

AND THE FOG, I DON'T KNOW IF

IT NECESSARILY TOUCHES ON

THIS, BUT WHEN ALL HELL STARTS

TO BREAK LOOSE AT THE END, THE

FOG ACTUALLY LIFTS AND IT

BECOMES CLEAR.

I DON'T KNOW WHAT TO MAKE OF

THAT.

IT'S JUST SOMETHING I'M

NOTING, AND MAYBE IT'S A KIND

OF CLARITY WHERE BOTH

CHARACTERS SIMPLY GIVE IN TO

THE EMOTIONS OF ALL THREE IN A

WAY.

YEAH.

EXCELLENT QUESTION.

>> HERE'S AN ARTICLE RIGHT

THERE.

YOU MIGHT WANT TO EXPAND ON IT

AND SEND IT OUT.

>> ELLIOTT HAS A QUESTION UP

THERE.

>> OKAY.

THIS WAS ACTUALLY INSPIRED BY

PROFESSOR ON THE RIGHT BUT I

DON'T KNOW WHAT YOUR NAME IS.

I'M WONDERING, DO YOU THINK

THAT THE KIND OF-- THAT THE

WAY YOU SAID-- HOW DO I

EXPLAIN THIS?

OKAY.

I WROTE THIS DOWN.

WHAT WOULD YOU SAY TO THE

COMMENT ABOUT THE KIND OF SOUL

WHICH FIND ITSELF IN A

DRAMATIC NOVEL AS ANY NORMAL

SANE PERSON, BEYOND THIS BOOK,

WOULD YOU BLAME PEOPLE

ANYWHERE IN NOVELS OR NOT THAT

COMMIT ATROCITIES OR ANYTHING

ELSE ARE NEW-- ARE FAULTED FOR

ANYTHING MORE THAN BEING

HUMAN, ASSUMING THAT THEY'RE

NOT INSANE OR PSYCHOPATHS?

>> (Laughing)

>> THERE YOU GO.

>> THAT'S GREAT.

IT'S GREAT.

>> Babak: WERE YOU SAYING

THAT-- AND I KNOW YOUR

QUESTION WAS FOR PROFESSOR

SOMMERS, BUT YOU'RE LINKING

THE FICTIONAL CHARACTER TO

REAL-LIFE HUMAN BEINGS OUT

THERE IN THE WORLD, AND WOULD

THE SAME THINGS THAT PROFESSOR

SOMMERS SAID ABOUT THE

FICTIONAL CHARACTERS KIND OF

HOLD TRUE?

IS THAT--

>> I GUESS I'M NOT READING--

TO AN EXTENT, NOT AS MUCH AS

SAYING TO REAL PEOPLE BUT THE

REASON THAT THEY DO THE THINGS

THEY DO AND WHY-- SHE SAID

THAT, IN A SENSE, THAT THEY

TRY TO REPENT AND BE GOOD AND

THAT THEIR ACTIONS COME AS A

RESULT AS THE SITUATION OR

THEIR LACK OF AWARENESS OF

THEIR SITUATION.

>> Elena: I DON'T KNOW IF I'M

GOING TO ANSWER YOUR QUESTION

CORRECTLY, BUT WHAT I THOUGHT

THAT I FOUND IS THAT EACH OF

THE THREE CHARACTERS HAS A

CERTAIN HUMANITY.

DON'T YOU AGREE THAT WE

DESPERATELY WANT THEM TO MAKE

THE RIGHT CHOICES, AND THEY

CONTINUE TO DISAPPOINT US, UP

TO THE LAST PAGE.

SO WE'RE NOT INDIFFERENT TO

THOSE CHARACTERS SO WE ARE

WITH THEM.

SOME STUDENTS SAY THEY HAVE TO

THROW THE BOOK DOWN ON THE

FLOOR A COUPLE TIMES AND THEN

THEY PICK IT UP AGAIN AND

CONTINUE READING.

SO THERE IS HUMANITY IN THEM.

WE FEEL FOR THEM, BUT THEN

THEY MAKE ALL THE WRONG TURNS

AND ALL THE WRONG DECISIONS AT

ALL THE WRONG TIMES.

SO THERE'S THE REALITY THERE.

I DON'T KNOW IF THAT'S

HELPING.

>> WELL, I'M WONDERING IF IT'S

SIMILAR TO THE WAY THAT REAL

PEOPLE MAKE THE WRONG

DECISIONS, BECAUSE A LOT OF

TIMES YOU SEE PEOPLE THAT,

LIKE, MAY DO THINGS, LIKE--

WELL, I CAN'T GIVE SPECIFIC

EXAMPLES BUT YOU KNOW, DRUGS,

ALCOHOL, ANYTHING PEOPLE CAN

DO TO REAL SCREW UP THEIR

LIFE.

THEY DON'T DO IT BECAUSE

THEY'RE MALICIOUS.

THEY DO IT BECAUSE-- THEY HAVE

REASONS.

>> COULD I STEP IN HERE?

PARTLY I THINK YOU'RE ASKING

ABOUT REPRESENTATION AND HOW

REPRESENTATIVE ARE FICTIONAL

CHARACTERS.

I MEAN I ADDRESSED THAT

QUESTION IN TERMS OF HOW

REPRESENTATIVE ARE THESE AS

IRANIAN CHARACTERS?

YOU SEEM TO BE ASKING HOW

REPRESENTATIVE ARE THESE

CHARACTERS AS NEUROTICS,

PSYCHOPATHS--

>> NO, NO.

>> I DON'T THINK HE WAS ASKING

THAT.

>> IS THAT RIGHT?

>> ARE THEY AS HUMANS, AND IF

WE'RE WILLING TO CUT SOME

SLACK FOR THESE CHARACTERS, DO

WE ALSO HAVE TO CUT SOME SLACK

FOR REAL HUMANS IN THE WORLD

WHO MAY HURT ONE ANOTHER

BECAUSE THEY'RE FOLLOWING

THEIR OWN DREAMS SELFISHLY OR

BLINDLY.

IS THAT WHAT YOU'RE ASKING?

>> YEAH.

ESPECIALLY IN THE ENDING

COMMENT YOU MADE ABOUT HOW

WRITERS AREN'T MEANT TO JUDGE

AS MUCH AS--

>> HEMINGWAY.

>> TO OBSERVE, WAS IT?

>> UNDERSTAND.

>> UNDERSTAND.

>> TRY TO UNDERSTAND.

>> Babak: COULD I REPHRASE

THAT QUESTION FOR EVERYONE TO

CONSIDER?

TO WHAT EXTENT IS THIS BOOK

KIND OF DETERMINISTIC MAYBE?

TO WHAT EXTENT ARE THESE

CHARACTERS FROM THE OUTSET

KIND OF DESTINED TO END UP

DOING WHAT THEY DO?

HOW MUCH DO THEY HAVE A

CHOICE, YOU KNOW, AND IS THAT

A STATEMENT ABOUT HUMAN

PSYCHOLOGY OUTSIDE THE BOOK, I

GUESS?

>> CAN I JUST STEP IN AND

CLARIFY.

>> PLEASE.

>> THE INITIAL IMPULSE OF THE

QUESTION BEFORE IT GOT PARCHED

OUT IN A VARIETY OF WAYS,

BECAUSE THIS IS A COMPLEX AND

INTERESTING QUESTION.

I LOVE THE COMPLEXITY AND THE

COMMENTARY AND THE EXCHANGE

WAS ILLUMINATING.

I THINK WHAT YOU WERE ASKING

INITIALLY, AND THE GIST OF

YOUR QUESTION IS THIS, IS THAT

THERE'S-- WE'RE AFFILIATING

VIA LITERATURE, RIGHT, WITH

SOMEONE WHO IS PERHAPS TRULY,

TRULY HEINOUS.

>> RIGHT.

>> THE PERSON WHO'S DRAWING

OUR SYMPATHY AND WHO WE KIND

OF AFFILIATE WITH AT THE END

IS CAPABLE OF ALL SORTS OF

HORRORS.

>> WAIT.

WHO ARE WE SYMPATHIZING WITH?

>> THE COLONEL.

>> BEHRANI.

>> SEE?

ISN'T THAT INTERESTING?

YOU SAID BEHRANI.

YOU SAID THE GIRL.

>> COLONEL.

>> OH, RIGHT.

OKAY, OKAY.

>> THE COLONEL.

>> OKAY, SORRY.

(Laughter)

>> A DISTURBING ASSET OF THE

SHAH OF IRAN AND OF THE EXODUS

OF PEOPLE FROM THAT SHAH OF

IRAN WHO HAD BENEFITTED FROM

THAT SHAH OF IRAN AND WHO, TO

THIS DAY, SIGNIFY THEIR

MATERIAL WEALTH IN INCREDIBLY

OSTENTATIOUS WAYS IN SOUTHERN

CALIFORNIA.

DIRECTION IS MULTIPLE, LIKE

SOUTH FLORIDA.

BUT HERE THE QUESTION IS ABOUT

SOMEONE WHO IS POTENTIALLY A

TORTURER OR AT LEAST, YOU

KNOW, SOMEONE WHO DID

SOMETHING HORRIBLE THAT WE'RE

NOT ABSOLUTELY SURE WE KNOW

THEY DID THAT OR NOT, AND PART

OF WHY THEY DID IT WAS IN FACT

TO MAINTAIN AN ORDER OF POWER

AND OF GOVERNMENT THAT AT

LEAST AS AMERICANS BENEFITTED

US VERY WELL.

>> THAT LEADS ME TO A QUESTION

THAT I HAVE FOR THE PANEL, AND

THAT IS DO YOU WORRY THAT THIS

BOOK MISREPRESENTS THE

IMMIGRANT EXPERIENCE, OR MAYBE

EVEN STEREOTYPES THE IMMIGRANT

EXPERIENCE?

I THINK A LOT OF PEOPLE IN

THIS COUNTRY HAVE A-- I GUESS

LOW IS THE ONLY WORD I CAN

THINK OF-- A DISTORTED VIEW OF

IRANIANS, AND THIS BOOK

DOESN'T PAINT A VERY LOVELY

PICTURE OR MAYBE EVEN A REAL

PICTURE.

DOES IT MISREPRESENT THE

IMMIGRANT EXPERIENCE?

>> Babak: IT-- I DON'T THINK

SO, ACTUALLY.

I MEAN, I WAS TRYING TO THINK

OF SOME WAY TO ANSWER THAT,

BUT MAYBE A STRAIGHTFORWARD

NO, IT DOESN'T MISREPRESENT

THEM.

IT'S A NARROW SLICE OF IRANIAN

IMMIGRANT SOCIETY, CERTAINLY;

BUT THE DESIRE FOR THAT

OSTENTATIOUS LIFESTYLE THAT

AHMIK WAS JUST REFERRING TO, I

SAW THAT EVERY DAY IN SAN

DIEGO.

I SAW IT IN THE HILLS OF LA

JOLLA, WHERE A LOT OF MY

MOTHER'S FRIENDS LIVED.

AND I WAS ALWAYS PUSHED TO

KIND OF PURSUE THAT, THOUGH,

YOU KNOW, I HAVE TO GIVE MY

MOM CREDIT HERE.

I DON'T WANT TO, YOU KNOW,

THINK SHE FELT THAT PRESSURE,

BECAUSE SHE WAS PART OF THE

SOCIETY.

BUT, AGAIN, I MEAN, YOU KNOW,

I ALSO SAW PEOPLE WHO TRIED TO

BREAK OUT OF THAT AND WHO

CHALLENGED IT.

NOW WOULD-- YOU KNOW, I

ACTUALLY KNEW A GUY IN SAN

DIEGO, WHO WE REFERRED TO AS

"THE COLONEL."

TO THIS DAY, I DON'T KNOW WHAT

HIS LAST NAME WAS.

WE JUST CALLED HIM THE

COLONEL.

NOW HE WAS A LOVELY MAN.

HE WAS GREAT TO HIS KIDS.

HE WAS FRIENDLY.

HE WAS NICE TO ME.

NOW, IF I HOLD UP THIS BOOK

AND REMEMBER MY FRIEND "THE

COLONEL," IT'S CERTAINLY A

MISREPRESENTATION, BUT ONLY IF

I TRY TO MAKE IT ONE-TO-ONE A

REPRESENTATION OF HIM.

I THINK IT'S REPRESENTATIVE OF

CERTAIN ISSUES.

ONE OF THE THINGS THE BOOK

DOES, IN A VERY SUBTLE WAY BUT

DOES IT WELL AND IT'S

DEFINITELY THERE, IS TO NOT

LEAVE THINGS LIKE THAT

UNEXPLAINED.

SO THE COLONEL'S CONNECTION TO

SAVAK IS THEN TEASED OUT WHEN

WE LEARN THAT LESTER'S WIFE

CAROL WAS A DEMONSTRATOR AND

ACTIVIST AND PROTESTED AGAINST

THINGS LIKE THE U.S.

INTERVENTION INTO IRAN IN

1953.

IT'S REVEALED THAT THIS GUY

BE-JAHN, THE COUSIN OR THE

NEPHEW OF THE GENERAL THAT

BEHRANI LOOKS UP TO, THAT HE

WAS TRAINED BY THE U.S.

NOW IS THAT A

MISREPRESENTATION OF THE U.S?

I COULD THROW THAT BACK IN THE

OTHER DIRECTION.

DO YOU THINK AMERICANS ARE

MISREPRESENTED IN THIS BOOK?

YES AND NO.

I THINK THERE'S SOME ACCURACY

TO THAT LINE, THAT WONDERFUL

LINE THAT PROFESSOR KRAY READ

ABOUT BEING GLUED TO THE SET

AND WANTING THAT SWEET TASTE

IN THE MOUTH, RIGHT?

DO YOU THINK THAT'S THE

ACCURATE REPRESENTATION OF YOU

ALL AS AMERICANS?

MAYBE, MAYBE NOT.

>> I'M SORRY.

I HAVE MY VCR SET.

(Laughing)

>> I'M NOT SURE I CAN ANSWER

YOUR QUESTION, BUT YOU

CERTAINLY HAVE GIVEN US LOTS

TO THINK ABOUT AND RAISED THE

QUESTIONS THAT ARE WORTH OUR

ATTENTION.

SO THANK YOU VERY MUCH, ALL

THREE OF YOU, FOR BEING HERE.

(Applause)

Maintained by Susan Mee